Most Accurate .3 Cal Semi-Auto Rifle?

[Nando Aqui]

Of the rifles with which you are familiar (your own, your friend's, etc.) which is the most accurate that fits the following criteria:

Action - - - - Semi-auto (or full auto restricted to semi)
Caliber - - - .3 (.308, 7.62x54, 7.62x39, 30-06, .300 SUMA, .300 WSM, etc.)
Feed - - - - - Magazine (so the Garands are out)
Sights - - - - Will readily accept scopes

Customized rifles are acceptable, but totally custom rifles; i.e., one-of-a-kind, are not.

This should be fun...

Alex

 

[George Hill]

Springfield's White Feather.

 

[MrMurphy]

Generally speaking the Springfield M1A models and variants with a scope. The FAL/G3 rifles can be quite accurate but the triggers sometime suffer.

The Dragunov SVD's tolerances aren't the greatest once you get past about 500-600 yards, from what I understand.

The H&K PSG-1 is a tackdriver from what I know and have seen, but they're expensive as hell, and about 18 lbs. A M1A can equal that for less in a lighter package.

 

[treeprof]

Don't forget the Browning BAR, esp. with the BOSS system. Lot's of folks report MOA or close to it with those.

 

[Steve Smith]

How about a custom build M1A?

Also, AR-10s built for accuracy.

 

[Jim K]

I do not own, but have had some experience with, the BAR in .300 Win Mag. (This is the sporting BAR, not the former military light machinegun.) Based on limited experience, I will vote for it as the most accurate. I might note that many pros agree.

As to the "assault rifle" type, I would vote for the M14/M1A, both accurized. Military teams have done some good work with the M14 and the M1A has done as well. The M15 might have been better, but I have never fired one, and have only seen one.

Jim

 

[KaceCoyote]

SR-25?

 

[Nando Aqui]

George - the White Feather surely has all the necessary elements, if we agree that the platform is correct to start with, and I'm not necessarily implying that it is not - - see below.

Steve - If we were to pursue both an M1A and an AR-10, both done by competent 'smiths' (like that?), wouldn't the AR-10 inherently have a greater potential? Some stiplulate that the non-symetrical oprod arrangement of the M1A can detract from accuracy.

Jim - I have one of those BARs, Grade II, in 30-06, which I bought when they first came out well over 30 years ago. Haven't shot it for a long time, I better get it out and test it. Of course, I would have to come up with some sort of magazine, as mine just has a 'box' that holds 4 rounds and snaps onto the hinged floor plate.

All interesting info...

Alex

 

[clubsoda22]

I think that new DPMS was giving very impressive groups.

 

[Nando Aqui]

CS22,

Yes, and I had my eye on them, specifically the DPMS Panther in .300 Rem SUMA. Unfortunately, the largest magazine capacity they are planning is a 5-rounder, which, BTW, is the same that Armalite has for the AR-10(T)Ultra Mag .300. These two, being of the AR platform, I thought would be excellent candidates for accuracy. As has been suggested elsewhere, perhaps someone will offer after-market higher capacity magazines for at least one of these rifles.

Alex

 

[TechBrute]

Stewart Wilson's Custom AR10s
Springfield Armory M25
HK PSG1

 

[mpthole]

My vote goes to the AR-10T (.308). I'm sure the SR-25 is right up there as well though. Two of the guys I shoot with, one has an AR-10T and the other a Springfield M1A National Match. The M1A has its quirks... some days its a great shooter and others it can hardly shoot 2 or 3 MOA much less 1... the AR-10T on the other hand - superb accuracy at ALL ranges. The -10T can make consistent, accurate hits out to 1,000 yards. The M1A on the other hand is consistently "inconsistant".

Just my .02 FRNs

 

[uglygun]

Throw that HK PSG1 in the nearest river and use it as a boat anchor....


Over priced for what it is and it's going to be a bear to have worked on if it ever goes down or needs to have something done like get it's barrel replaced. Granted the HK PSG1 is probably the most reliable of the bunch in terms of operation but god who can justify that kind of price, field one HK PSG1 or afford to build up a nice collection of VERY capable long range sticks that comprise both bolt actions and semiautos?

For accurized customs....

The M1A and the AR15/10 actions are my choice. Call George Gardner at GA Precision and ask what his M1A to M25 builds are doing if that's the action you prefer, he'll build you a better gun BAR NONE when compared to the Springfield so called M25(if you want one built to spec George will get you closer than Springfield any day of the week). Then ask him how his AR10s do with a Mike Rock barrel and how easy it is to maintain it's accuracy compared to something like an accurized M1A.


The AR10 is my preferred accurized semiauto stick with the M1A coming a close second. The AR10 is remarkably versatile when it comes to being able to get various barrel options, chambering options, and configurations to match a shooter and his needs. When something should arise that needs doing, the AR10 allows the shooter to do a lot of his own work thanks to the absurdly simple design.


For box stock accurate semiautos... the AR10 actions are again my favorite whether it be the Armalite AR10, DPMS 308, or the Knights SR-25s all in target configuration. Very routine for these guns to average under 1 MOA, usually settling in at 3/4MOA or less with loads that the guns like.

George Gardner could probably build up an AR10 for a price that would compete very favorably with the price of an Armalite AR10 T or Knights SR25. The DPMS 308 is a relative bargin at just over 1k dollars from what I've seen and it's accuracy is quite decent by the sounds of it.

 

[vsse]

Are any of these rifles NOT expensive?

 

[uglygun]

Just said, the DPMS 308 goes for around 1k dollars. That's a fair bargin.



For an accurized AR10 you're lookin at around 1600-2200 dollars depending on how it is configured and how it was built, the Eagle Arms AR10s were a legit option for building an accurized AR10 type rifle on the cheap.


For a custom built AR10, buying into something like an AR10 A4 and then simply having a freefloat tube installed may yield quite nice results with a rifle consistently sub MOA. Price for rifle probably being around 1600-1700 depending on whether you replaced the trigger and what type of handguard used.


Compare to a custom M1A or accurized M1A which rarely go for under 1800 dollars and only go up from there. A George Gardner M25 would probably wind up being around 2500 dollars or somewhere there abouts.


I spent 1400 dollars for my AR10 A4, gonna have a custom upper built for it eventually in 260Rem which will probably cost around 1k dollars which is a pretty fair price compared to the Armalite upper assemblies that are similarly priced for an accurized factory upper.

 

[Dionysusigma]

$1,000 = more than I make in two months. Not for me.

However, the only .3 cal that I'm familiar with, including mine or my friends, is my SAR-1... so I guess wins for "Best Accuracy."

 

[TechBrute]

Throw that HK PSG1 in the nearest river and use it as a boat anchor....

Yeah, it's complete junk.

Opening with a ridiculus statement like that leads me to believe the rest of your post may be as equally nieve. Yes, it's very expensive. Yes, it's probably overpriced. However, the reason it's overpriced as much as it is is because of artificial price hikes due to ridiculus import laws. I didn't notice where anyone asked for the best value in 30 cal rifles, and yes, the PSG1 is one of the most accurate out of the box 30 cal rifles ever made in a factory, regardless whether or not you can afford one.

 

[TechBrute]

Are any of these rifles NOT expensive?

As everyone else tells you time and time again, you get what you pay for in most cases.

 

[uglygun]

The boat anchor comment comes from the absurd weight of the thing.

People complain that the AR10 is a bench queen or range queen due to it's reliability, well okay the HK type rifles have the reliability but they have their own draw backs such as the HK PSG1's rediculous weight which is likely to make it as much of a range queen as any accurized AR10.


Hence the "boat anchor" comment with reference to it's weight.


Everyone is entitled to their own opinions but as far as I'm concerned the HK PSG1 is more of a status symbol with a certain amount of perceived prestige. The price is absurd, even if their numbers weren't artificially controlled and they were down closer to 7-8k dollars they'd still be over priced just like the rest of HK's firearms. There is little out there that suggests to me that the HK PSG1 has an accuracy advantage over other accurized semiautos that justifies the price.

MAYBE an HK SR9 with a couple upgrades to make it a bit more PSG1 like if that's what somebody is seeking in a rifle but even the SR9s are over priced.


Sure would be nice if a couple owners of the various rifles could get together for one big grudge match and see just exactly how the guns fair in direct competition with eachother comparing things like accuracy, ergonomics, modularity, and reliability.



I cannot say that I have had an opportunity to put in time behind an HK PSG1 but reports from those who do own the things or have experience with them put them right into similiar performance ranges as an accurized AR10 or SR25. HK seems to be the first to get there with respects to fielding an accurate semiauto from the factory and I'll get them recognition where it is due with that respect. The rifle however has gained some kind of cult status which is viewed as being superior to just about everything else one could consider, which I don't think is entirely justified given the other options out there.

 

[TechBrute]

The boat anchor comment comes from the absurd weight of the thing.

You've got a point there.

The PSG1 should be priced around $7K, as you mentioned. That puts it about $2K over what a custom AR10, M25, etc with glass would cost. That puts it right in line with the rest of HK's overpriced, overbuilt, quality firearms. It fits right in with their design philosophy.

 

[uglygun]

I don't know if it would be right in line with a custom built AR10, a person should be able to come up with a really fabulous accurized AR10 with something like a Mike Rock or Hart barrel for something around 3200 or so.

Figure an AR10 A4 as a base rifle for close to 1400 dollars, throw in a 2 stage trigger, adjustable stock, and a 2nd accurized upper assembly at around 1-1.2k dollars and the total rifle cost without optics would be probably around 2800-3k dollars. Add rings and mounts into that along with a scope for each upper at maybe an additional 700-800 per upper assembly which would be around 1500 to maybe 1800 depending how high quality you could go.

If the HK PSG1 did go for 7k dollars it still seems like it would go for a good 3-4k dollars more than a custom built AR10 would go for, maybe 2k more than what a custom built AR10 would go for along with a spare general use upper.


Knights on the other hand with their SR25, they certainly will play the exclusivity game with something like their MK11 Mod 0 "SEAL gun" with package price going for around 6-7k.

 

[TechBrute]

for apples to apples, you need to add the price of glass to any rifle that you're comparing to the PSG1, since it comes with glass.

 

[Zak Smith]

I've got a JP Enterprises custom AR10 which shoots about 0.7MOA.

-z

 

[Nando Aqui]

-Z

I looked at JP's website, and they have various offerings for their AR-10s.

Any details of your JP AR-10 you would like to share?

Thanks-

Alex

 

[Zak Smith]

Mine has the 20" LW barrel and the BC Comp (muzzle attachment). I'm using a shorter stock (not pictured) to get the right length of pull.

The ACOG is good for 3Gun (or hunting!), but for long range precise shooting, I mount a Leu 4.5-14X M1.

-z