NC sure has a weird definition of 'antique firearm'

[LAR-15]

14‑409.11. "Antique firearm" defined.

(a) The term "antique firearm" means any of the following:

(1) Any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured on or before 1898.

(2) Any replica of any firearm described in subdivision (1) of this subsection if the replica is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition.

(3) Any muzzle loading rifle, muzzle loading shotgun, or muzzle loading pistol, which is designed to use black powder substitute, and which cannot use fixed ammunition. what is black powder substitute? Pyrodex?
(b) For purposes of this section, the term "antique firearm" shall not include any weapon which:

(1) Incorporates a firearm frame or receiver. (don't ALL firearms?)

(2) Is converted into a muzzle loading weapon.

(3) Is a muzzle loading weapon that can be readily converted to fire fixed ammunition by replacing the barrel, bolt, breechblock, or any combination thereof. (1969, c. 101, s. 2; 2006‑259, s. 7(a).)

 

[Detritus]

(b) For purposes of this section, the term "antique firearm" shall not include any weapon which:

(1) Incorporates a firearm frame or receiver.

From what i remember of what i was told by a friend of mine (Durham Co. sheriff's Deputy) about 10 years or so ago. which admittedly may be flawed...

this supposedly Means that it's not an "Antique Firearm" if it includes a frame or receiver from a gun that falls under the regular "Firearm" classification. I.E. you can't build some weird muzzle stuffer out of parts that includes a frame or receiver that has to be put on a form 4477, and still call it an "antique firearm" (can't have a muzzleloader AR)

and certain muzzleloaders on the market that LOOK like they use a "firearm" receiver or frame (per the NC definition) are allowed into the category b/c their receivers are not readily convertible to the use of fixed ammo.

 

[Pat McCoy]

Blackpowder substitutes are Pyrodex, Triple 7, Jim shockeys Gold, and others. They are non-pwder based, and can be stored by dealers.

No, al firearms do not have receivers or frames. Most muzzleloading rifles and single shot pistols have barrels inletted into stocks, with locks also inletted in to the stock. No frame or receiver.

looks to me like the NC law allows most single shot muzzleloading rifles and oistols, but no revolvers or rifles with frames/receivers (rolling blocks, sharps, etc).

 

[LAR-15]

In section (a) they claim any firearm made in or before 1898 is an antique yet in section (b) they declare they are not antiques because they have a frame or reciever.

Or that's how I read it.

 

[Scoupe]

They are refering to the (non-posted in your example) definition of a "firearm". No blackpowder handguns built on a S&W 686 frame type stuff is what they mean.

Detritus has it right.

 

[Jim K]

It sounds to me like they wanted to exclude "in-line" muzzle loaders from the "antique" category and botched things all up.

I suspect that, as in many states, the laws are written by staffers with little idea of what they are talking about. They get different opinions from "experts" and try to come up with a law, but the result is a contradictory mishmash. Then floor amendments seldom make things any better. Congress has the same problem, but usually the staff work is better and the "experts" more informed.

When a law leaves itself open to widely varying "interpretation" by the police, it is not a good law.

Jim

 

[LAR-15]

That sounds like it.

They wrote it badly.

 

[Justin]

Reading the law, it looks like it was written to cover things like the conversion cylinders that allow you to fire centerfire ammunition out of a blackpowder pistol.

 

[LAR-15]

I disagree.

This definition was passed last year and was just put into the law.

I think they were trying to copy Federal law (the GCA definiton of antique) and they botched writing it.

Federal law allows a black powder revolver to be converted to firing cartridges.

 

[The Rifleman]

They ought to call them Primitive Weapons. Not antique's.

 

[benEzra]

(b) For purposes of this section, the term "antique firearm" shall not include any weapon which:

(1) Incorporates a firearm frame or receiver.

For the purposes of this section, you can view "antique firearm" and "firearm" as two entirely different terms. The paragraph is just saying that "antique firearm" as defined by the law does NOT include guns built on non-blackpowder receivers, or conversions from non-blackpowder weapons. Yes, it could have been written better, but the meaning is pretty clear, IMO.

 

[LAR-15]

Not really.

This section (section b) refers to ????


Which includes firearms with frames and recievers (those made in or before 1898).

What they meant to do I think is make section (b) apply only to definition (3) in section (a) but that did not happen and section (b) (1,), (2), and (3) apply to every firearm defined in section (a).

So they ended up declaring firearms made in or before 1898 antiques in section (a) and then unintentionally removed them from being 'antiques" in section (b).

I sent my rep a note to rewrite this definition in the upcoming session.