Odd Feedback On The Ammo Shortage

[Warp]

OK, let's. It started softly again with the Colorado movie theater shooting, grew with the second debate when Obama said he wanted to reinstate a more effective Assault Weapons Ban, jumped when Obama won reelection in November and went off the charts when, before he was inaugurated again, was in a race with the NY Governor to see who could propose and initiate the most draconian anti-gun legislation none of which would have stopped the Sandy Hook shooting they exploited.

And it hasn't ended since.

Feel free to check my timeline and the cadence of the Great Obama Run On Guns Two...

I don't recall any kind of a great run on anything until Sandy Hook.

I even made a point of touring LGS' and gun/ammo retailers in mid November, after the election, and there was plenty of everything. It basically stayed that way until Sandy Hook. That, and the ensuing ridiculousness from our elected officials, is what really set all of this off.

 

[MattShlock]

Warp -- your memory notwithstanding, as you may not have seen it given your perspective just go look at the NICS checks some bright fella posted above.

I swear we must be getting the government we deserve!

 

[Warp]

Warp -- your memory notwithstanding, if you weren't paying attention just go look at the NICS checks some bright fella posted above.

I swear we must be getting the government we deserve!

Yes...

But the highest month is December, and December, January, and February are all higher than November.\

And it jumped more than 38% from November to December. And that was with Sandy Hook not even happening until halfway through the month, with the post-election results being in for almost all of November

 

[MattShlock]

O.K. You're not disagreeing with anything I wrote Warp.

To put it so simply everyone can understand it, the least-odd feedback about the ammo shortage is...

...it hasn't been caused by everyone buying up as much as the world could produce and get here because Americans are afraid of a school shooting in their neighborhood!

 

[Warp]

O.K. You're not disagreeing with anything I wrote Warp.

To put it so simply everyone can understand it, the least-odd feedback about the ammo shortage is...

...it hasn't been caused by everyone buying up as much as the world could produce and get here because Americans are afraid of a school shooting in their neighborhood!

Ya think?

I don't recall any kind of a great run on anything until Sandy Hook.

I even made a point of touring LGS' and gun/ammo retailers in mid November, after the election, and there was plenty of everything. It basically stayed that way until Sandy Hook. That, and the ensuing ridiculousness from our elected officials, is what really set all of this off.

Of course when people say that the ridiculousness from our politicians after Sandy Hook is what set this off, that doesn't mean that people are buying ammo because they are afraid of somebody shooting up their neighborhood school.

It means they are buying ammo because they are afraid of what ridiculous stuff the elected officials/politicians might do.

You know, like what California just passed.

 

[MattShlock]

Warp, I meant we agree the crescendo of this Gun Run The Second was in Dec. when the Obama administration doubled-down to reinstitute an expanded Assault Weapons Ban and start a national gun registration post Sandy Hook! But that's not when it started.

You may be a little worse with numbers than remembering relatively recent history... So look at the NICS figures growth Year-over-Year and Month-over-Month for the time frame I outlined -- basically August 2012 and on. This ammo shortage is clearly rooted in fear of having, and a foolish nation reelecting, anti-gun politicians who "never let a good crisis go to waste"*.


*Rahm Emanuel, former creepy ballerina and current Mayor of Chicago while he was Obama's White House Chief of Staff.

 

[Warp]

It never would have been 20% what it is if not for Sandy Hook.

And weeks after the election it wasn't anywhere NEAR as bad as it was in January.

 

[MattShlock]

Oh Warp, let me help a little on this one as it may not be as intuitive as I thought.

Aurora? 16% increase in NICS checks Aug YoY.

Debates/AWB-II announcement? 20% increase October YoY.

Re-Election? 31% increase November YoY. ("Oh no, Obama's reelection had no effect on anything." Are you kidding?)

Sandy Hook, Assault Weapons/High-Capacity Magazine Ban Bill/National Registration initiative? 50% increase December YoY.

"Wouldn't be 20% of what it was" you say? Well, pay careful attention here: Obama's reelection was (YoY November's) 31% of December's 50% (maybe more as Sandy Hook was Dec. 14th), or, a minimum of 62% of what happened in December WITHOUT Sandy Hook! Yes, we know it got even worse after that due to the Left's relentless attack on our 2nd Amendment rights. Sandy Hook just expedited the gun-grab every rational American gun-buyer or owner saw coming as indicated by the decline in ammo availability (whether you personally noticed it or not) in the months leading up to Sandy Hook, and that's proven by the statistics.

I hope you don't need an Advil, Warp, between the math and the crashing of your position that the run on guns and ammo was just Sandy Hook/December related; that it was somehow separate, distinct, from the Left-wing anti-gun politicians' agenda as well as their (re)election in 2012. You couldn't be more wrong. This is so obvious Hellen Keller could see it and if you maintain your argument I'm sure everyone will wonder if your "error" is intentional or not.

I think I've clearly demonstrated the ammo shortage and propagandizing politcal environment patriots clearly see are directly linked. And the continued undermining of basic rights from the top down is why this current 14-month run on ammo is as slow to recover as the economy. There's no secret conspiracy. The Left is quite out in the open about it if not their overall agenda to disarm America.

If anyone still feels strangely compelled to deny that and argue that the Great Gun (and ammo) Run II came out of nowhere with Sandy Hook while the government's own facts stare you in the face and prove you wrong you may, but not with me.

I hope this has helped...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84ptFVq22PY

 

[Deer_Freak]

I haven't seen any 9mm ammo at all for a decent price for months. Then I find GECO 124 gr for $13.99. The retailer had a 10 box limit. I did buy 10. GECO is quality ammo, comparable to Winchester Ranger 124 gr NATO. I was getting GECO for $10/$11 last year at this time.

I do think manufacturers are creating some of the cost increases. Several ammo manufacturers have got new equipment or retooled the equipment they have. They don't have to say ammo is going up to pay for the new equipment because everyone is already blaming Obama. I also think we would have had a shortage after Sandy Hook even if Romney was elected. Obama is a wanabe gun grabber. Romney is a proven gun grabber.

Obama being in office likely preserved our second ammendment rights because the republicans won't work with him. If Romney was president after Sandy Hook the republicans would have run a bipartisan AWB through so quick our heads would be spinning. The major gun companies would love to kill all these grass roots shops making AR15's. If they are making AR15's now they will be making AR10's in a few years. Like any business they are going to expand their line of products. The big dogs can't have that.

 

[goon]

I found 9mm 115 grain Federal at Walmart the other day for $15 a box. The local gun stores are asking $20 for CCI 124 grain FMJ. It's not a good price, but it is available at least (in my area).

 

[Bexar]

Someone may have already posted these thoughts but I don't feel at the moment like reading several more pages of comments. Like anything else nowadays...who has any idea of what's going on.

One...as one guy mentioned it's the major AR-15 makers pushing out the rifles in .22 LR. If you buy it...you got to feed it.

Two...current crapper rumor according to the folks that might know what their talking about is that the Great Obama wants to ban all foreign imports of ammunition and double up on the Federal excise tax for domestically produced ammo. I can't remember where I read that but I don't react to liberal or conservative political gossip rags any more but I remember this article made me say a naughty when I saw the articles source.

Three...the 22LR is the most used training round for vast majority of LE agencies and parents teaching their kids to shoot. Lot of catch-up time for that, right now.

Regardless of why people are still panic buying...they are slowing down but the fever has not yet subsided. Flippers...I hope they have to eat their greed.

And the other thing is hunting season is coming up and let the .22 games begin.

 

[Warp]

We would not be in the ammo situation we are in now if not for Sandy Hook.

 

[Bexar]

Isn't this the third panic buying dust-up that Obama having been elected generated? The first one was when he was elected...the second was the AWB 2.0 attempt...and now Sandy Hook. It will be interesting to see how these Executive Orders go Boo! Made me think.

 

[MattShlock]

Isn't this the third panic buying dust-up that Obama having been elected generated? The first one was when he was elected...the second was the AWB 2.0 attempt...and now Sandy Hook. It will be interesting to see how these Executive Orders go Boo! Made me think.

The AWB 2.0 that had people becoming desparate for ammo again came in at least two, if not three, waves.

The first was during the October debate with Romney that included the 2nd Amendment as a topic where Obama declared he would reinstitute an expanded AWB. That had an immediate impact though it was subdued because right-thinking people expected, or at least hoped, he couldn't possibly be reelected after his terrible first term. Many would wait and see -- these poor fools didn't learn from 2008 nor Aurora. Mistake!

Obama's reelection in November got everyone's attention. And though there was no emergency it was largely too late already.

Obama's exploitation of Sandy Hook in December to legislate the AWB 2.0 Bill and introduce a law requiring de facto national registration of all firearms was the straw that broke the camel's back and it still hasn't fully healed. Add that local case in Florida we can't mention, where The President injected national racism, and Americans have been buying all the ammo that can be had. It has been almost nine months since Sandy Hook -- Americans expect something bad is inevitably going to happen here.

 

[jrdolall]

I think back to 2008-09. I had quite a few .22 rifles and several pistols. I had a pump .22 and 3 semi auto .22 rifles with several semi pistols and a couple of revolvers. A brick of ammo would last me a month easily simply because it took time to reload everything in the field.

Move forward to 2012. I have all of the above firearms. I have added multiple semi auto pistols as well as 7 AR type .22 rifles with multiple magazines for each gun.

I wonder why I need more .22 ammo than I did 5 years ago?

 

[j1]

The only time that I will buy a 22 is when I do not have a single round left and then I will buy one 50 round box to stoke my Baretta Bobcat.

 

[goon]

I'll buy more .22 as it's available at reasonable prices. I may make the effort to swing into the local Walmart a couple times this coming week just on the off chance I can pick up a brick or two. I don't "need" it, but a couple more bricks would make my practice supply a little more secure for another few months.

You can still buy it. Just don't buy it at an unreasonable price.

 

[Queen_of_Thunder]

I think back to 2008-09. I had quite a few .22 rifles and several pistols. I had a pump .22 and 3 semi auto .22 rifles with several semi pistols and a couple of revolvers. A brick of ammo would last me a month easily simply because it took time to reload everything in the field.

Move forward to 2012. I have all of the above firearms. I have added multiple semi auto pistols as well as 7 AR type .22 rifles with multiple magazines for each gun.

I wonder why I need more .22 ammo than I did 5 years ago?

Sure makes one wonder. I'm sure we will figure it out one day.

 

[Queen_of_Thunder]

Oh Warp, let me help a little on this one as it may not be as intuitive as I thought.

Aurora? 16% increase in NICS checks Aug YoY.

Debates/AWB-II announcement? 20% increase October YoY.

Re-Election? 31% increase November YoY. ("Oh no, Obama's reelection had no effect on anything." Are you kidding?)

Sandy Hook, Assault Weapons/High-Capacity Magazine Ban Bill/National Registration initiative? 50% increase December YoY.

"Wouldn't be 20% of what it was" you say? Well, pay careful attention here: Obama's reelection was (YoY November's) 31% of December's 50% (maybe more as Sandy Hook was Dec. 14th), or, a minimum of 62% of what happened in December WITHOUT Sandy Hook! Yes, we know it got even worse after that due to the Left's relentless attack on our 2nd Amendment rights. Sandy Hook just expedited the gun-grab every rational American gun-buyer or owner saw coming as indicated by the decline in ammo availability (whether you personally noticed it or not) in the months leading up to Sandy Hook, and that's proven by the statistics.

I hope you don't need an Advil, Warp, between the math and the crashing of your position that the run on guns and ammo was just Sandy Hook/December related; that it was somehow separate, distinct, from the Left-wing anti-gun politicians' agenda as well as their (re)election in 2012. You couldn't be more wrong. This is so obvious Hellen Keller could see it and if you maintain your argument I'm sure everyone will wonder if your "error" is intentional or not.

I think I've clearly demonstrated the ammo shortage and propagandizing politcal environment patriots clearly see are directly linked. And the continued undermining of basic rights from the top down is why this current 14-month run on ammo is as slow to recover as the economy. There's no secret conspiracy. The Left is quite out in the open about it if not their overall agenda to disarm America.

If anyone still feels strangely compelled to deny that and argue that the Great Gun (and ammo) Run II came out of nowhere with Sandy Hook while the government's own facts stare you in the face and prove you wrong you may, but not with me.

I hope this has helped...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84ptFVq22PY

One has to admit that Sandy Hook and the ramped up anti gun efforts coming after it, some very sucessful, has not been a major contributor to this ammo shortage. I would say 95% of the shortage is the result of that event and the politics after it.

 

[grubbylabs]

I bought my first and only AR the next week after the election because I had a feeling something was going to happen that would put our rights in jeopardy. I had no Idea it was going to be something as horrible as Sandy Hook, I was thinking along the lines of legislation.

I can't imagine I was the only person to think as I did. I would not be surprised if hundreds or even thousands of people suspected something was going to happen just as I did and start the ball rolling. Then having that horrible event come along only supercharged the process.

 

[Trent]

All of you worried about "when will ammo get back to normal..."

Just.. Stop and look around.

Not at the gun shops. At your neighbors and friends.

The entire COUNTRY is stockpiling arms and ammunition, continues to do so.

And you are all complaining?

Good grief, men.

Show some pride. If there was ever a message gun owners could send to the powers that be, it's very simple.

"We've got more bullets and WAY more guns than you. NOW go ahead and push us around."

Never in the history of Earth has a peasant population been so.. well, heavily armed.

Sandy hook might have screwed up your summer shooting plans.

But the stockpile Americans have amassed has ensured our freedom for generations to come. No one is going to even THINK about messing with the American people. Ever.

Pride, guys.

Show some.

 

[Ignition Override]

Trent: Those are very valid viewpoints.

Let's pray that for several different reasons, our White House never selects another Janet Reno/Eric Holder type to work as Attorney General, but let's keep a fierce, focused eye on the new ATF Director, and his staff who might be unknowns with a much lower public profile, if any. These people would be welcome in the Peoples' Republic of China.

Did Janet Reno ever state why she said that "Our goal is to outlaw private gun ownership", or similar words to that effect?

 

[jcwit]

YUP! We're getting heavily armed with .22 rimfire. LOL

 

[MattShlock]

I had a feeling something was going to happen that would put our rights in jeopardy. I had no Idea it was going to be something as horrible as...

What is going on with you people? The "something" that "happened" was what politicians were elected, not what incident they chose to exploit to disarm Americans this time!

Do most of you really not get all this!?

The Party must disarm you.

 

[Warp]

All of you worried about "when will ammo get back to normal..."

Just.. Stop and look around.

Not at the gun shops. At your neighbors and friends.

The entire COUNTRY is stockpiling arms and ammunition, continues to do so.

And you are all complaining?

Good grief, men.

Show some pride. If there was ever a message gun owners could send to the powers that be, it's very simple.

"We've got more bullets and WAY more guns than you. NOW go ahead and push us around."

Never in the history of Earth has a peasant population been so.. well, heavily armed.

Sandy hook might have screwed up your summer shooting plans.

But the stockpile Americans have amassed has ensured our freedom for generations to come. No one is going to even THINK about messing with the American people. Ever.

Pride, guys.

Show some.

I can think of several (large!) state governments whose actions, past and present (right down to the past week), say exactly the opposite.

Or have you not heard that in New York you can be arrested (and people HAVE) for putting 8 rounds into a magazine?