Open Carry Unsafe?

[runswithscissors]

Some of my friends who CCW say they think that open carry is not very safe and often leave their piece in the car when traveling to certain areas(where open carry is required ie bar etc..). I happen to disagree. I have no problem with open carry. I prefer CCW becuase it draws less stares, but I by no means feel unsafe.
My buddies say that open carry is only "advertising" that you have a gun. I'm like, duh. Would you rather rob someone that 'might' have a gun or rob someone who does have a gun. Easy choice there for me. Sure you lose the element of surprise, but then again, with that nice gun just sitting there, would you really need the element of surprise?


What do you guys think? Is open carry an open invitation for someone to take your gun from you or an open invitation to offer someone a free ride to the city morgue?


I opt for the later, if someone has a gun on thier hip, I doubt that I would want to bother that person or the people they were with. I might keep my eye on them, but that's all.

 

[Kamicosmos]

Problem is when someone intend on killing comes in. They see your gun, their sights are already on YOU. You'll be dead before the action starts. This could be a robbery at the gas station, a mass killer about to act, etc.

Concealed for me. I want every advantage on my side, including them not knowing I'm armed.

 

[fjolnirsson]

Well, given the choice of no gun, or an openly carried gun, I'll take the gun every time.

 

[hightech]

Open carrying

In Virginia the only time you HAVE to open carry is in a place that serves alcohol beverages by the drink. I have carried over 300 times in 6 years and do not have a problem. Over 95% of the people do not even know that you are carrying. Stop and think about it. When was the last time you sat in a restaurant and watched everyone coming in to see if they were carrying? I am willing to bet you have never watched, I certainly do not. I am busy enjoying my meal and the company I am with. This open carry is all hype by the media and activist on both the left and right. Concealed carry would be better but why not have a little fun when you go out?

 

[Parallax]

Advantage of open carry: Lets the sheeple see that gun owners are just regular people.

Disadvantage: Suppose you're standing in line at a bank and an armed robber comes in. You're going to be his first target (unless a lot of other people are open carrying).

 

[bratch]

Noone can compliment you on your fine choice in sidearms and leather if its concealed.

Assuming you have fine choices of sidearms and leather

 

[Zeke Menuar]

In the woods here in Monsoon Central I prefer open carry. Especially in the summer. I usually carry a LW Commander and lots of mags. So far I havent got a second look from the "veggie-nazi" crowd. My cap and ball revolver doesn't even merit a second look. A new holster for the CZ-83 is on the way. Should be a fine small critter gun. About the open carry, if I have a jacket on, and I get hot on the trail, than the coat comes off. If the veggie-nazi-liberal -peacemongers think I'm wrong, I'll GIVE then copy of the ORS so in the few minutes they may be sober thay can read the law.

However slinging a M38 Mosin over the shoulder gets some looks until bear sign is noticed. Then I become pretty popular on the trail.

People tend to give my SKS a wide berth, it being an evil commie gun. Made even More Evil by installing a MurryGun retrofit SKS springloaded firing pin. No slamfies. Also My trigger group arrived from Kivaari. Very nice smoth trigger. %100 improvement.

Grandads M99-R with it's new reciever sight get all the ohhs and ahhs from the old timers.

After we get moved into the new house, I plan to take the Ishapore2A and No1mkIII to the hills for a trial run and see what happens. The Ishy is heavy but a dream to shoot and real accurate.

the tula ex-sniper shoot good, but a Huber trigger should make it better.

The safest place for your handgun is securely attached to your body.

ZM

 

[TallPine]

Neither. (certainly not the second, I hope)

Though I would be dang careful about retention in a crowded environment.

I don't usually open carry in town, except sometimes when just stopping to get gas. Nobody ever seems to notice.

 

[q102josh]

personally i dont see why anyone would ever open-carry, even in places where its required... conceiled means conceiled afterall

 

[30 cal slob]

If you're walking around with a pistol in an IWB holster, is it halfway concealed or halfway open?

 

[Vern Humphrey]

My buddies say that open carry is only "advertising" that you have a gun.

Police officers not only carry openly, but also wear uniforms that make it easy to spot them. If open carry endangered people, you'd think the streets would be littered with dead cops.

 

[WayneConrad]

Open carry is not about safety

Open carry is about not going to the back of the bus. It's about not steaming the curls out of your hair. It's about not going through the star-on machine. You do it because it's right, not because it's safe, and people doing the right thing can make a difference.

 

[Bear Gulch]

I have open carried. I would never carry in a bar due to the butt head who will feel obligated to pick a fight. I also don't go into bars anyhow. Actually, that not true, I snuck into one to use the john during our archery league 2 week ago because the range lacks one.

 

[Malamute]

I carried open in Az for years, before CCW's were available (or common anyway) and never had any trouble. Some odd looks from tourists, and some questions, tho most seemed think it sort of "interesting" rather than scary. The nickel Colt SAA got the most "admiring comments", including from the nice AZ HP guys when I got a speeding ticket in 1982 or so.

This was back in my motorycle days, and tho I didn't drink, we sometimes went into bars to get something cold to drink, or to eat. The bars would "check" your guns while you were there, and turn them back over to you when you left. It wasn't unusual to see a half dozen guns on the backbar on a weekend afternoon.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

I have open carried. I would never carry in a bar due to the butt head who will feel obligated to pick a fight. I also don't go into bars anyhow.

In my opinion, alcohol and firearms don't mix. After all, the reason for carrying a gun is that you might have to use it. If that happens, you don't want to be impaired.

Now a lot of states have a stupid law that prohibits carry in a place with an "on-premises license" -- meaning a place that serves liquor. That includes a lot of restaurants. It doesn't make sense to leave your gun locked up when taking your family to the restaurant.

In Virginia, the CCW law forbade carrying in places with an on-premises license, but not the open carry law. So a lot of people would march up to the restaurant door, take off their jackets or cover garment, and go in open carry.

Stupid laws! :banghead:

 

[mustanger98]

bratch:

Noone can compliment you on your fine choice in sidearms and leather if its concealed.

Assuming you have fine choices of sidearms and leather

I make my own. I made a couple of purty holsters for my Ruger's Vaqueroes and my family's against carrying in the current peaceable environment where we live. (I've told 'em it only takes one nut to walk in and start something that'll make 'em wish I'd packed my sidearm that day.) So, alas, to keep the peace at home, nobody gets to see the gunleather I built and am so proud of. And one of those holsters has a real nice, if I say so, full-geometric stamp that covers the whole outside.

30 cal slob:

If you're walking around with a pistol in an IWB holster, is it halfway concealed or halfway open?

The way GA law reads, you can carry a sidearm any way you want as long as it's in a holster. It might be a belt holster or a shoulder holster or other type that may, or maybe not, be covered by your clothes, briefcase, purse, etc. So in GA, I guess it don't matter. In AZ, you're openly carrying as long as part of your sidearm is visible, IIRC. So, if you have no permit and wear no jacket and you carry in a IWB holster, you're carrying open.

Open carry is about not going to the back of the bus.

Yeah. We have racial equality and tolerance. How about a little more tolerance for us gun people and those of us who'll take responsibility for our own safety?

hightech:

When was the last time you sat in a restaurant and watched everyone coming in to see if they were carrying? I am willing to bet you have never watched, I certainly do not. I am busy enjoying my meal and the company I am with.

When I'm out and around, I tend to try to be alert to a number of things. Mostly, I'm hoping I don't miss seeing somebody I know or something cool. I pay attention to who's packin' too. We do have a number of citizens who carry around here.

In GA, it's illegal to carry in bars. Same way, last I really understood, in TN and don't really know how the situation has changed. And a bar is probably one of the last places you'd want to be without a weapon of some kind. But then, that's what a garrison belt or a broke longneck's for.

 

[Bear Gulch]

Vern, I fully agree that alcohol and gun powder don't mix. I don't drink and haven't since I was 19. I do go to bars just like I avoid areas in town that would increase the likelyhood of having to use my arm. I feel that because I carry doesn't mean I should go looking for trouble. Having to place a serious hand to Mr Glock would mean extreme failure in my other skills.

 

[Andrew Rothman]

mustanger98, come on over here and show us that purty leather!

 

[TheFederalistWeasel]

I personally don’t agree with open carry for several reasons

First let the B/G think you are a sheep right up to the point he turns his focus on you away for an instant in an armed robbery and realizes you have a gun when he hears it go off.

Our (LEO) calls for people with guns will go thru the roof, a lot more police encounters will immediately attract the attention of the media who will use it to attract the attention of liberal politicians who will begin screaming WILD WEST, BLOOD IN THE STREETS!!! And no one will hear the calm voice of reason pointing to strong evidence to the contrary, and you know one or two of these encounters will got to hell in a hand basket due to stupidity on both sides and the fecal matter will hit the Westinghouse which is precisely what you don’t want and what the RATS will point to howling and wailing.

Frankly I don’t want any one to know, I’m carrying, period!

 

[TheFederalistWeasel]

The way GA law reads, you can carry a sidearm any way you want as long as it's in a holster. It might be a belt holster or a shoulder holster or other type that may, or maybe not, be covered by your clothes, briefcase, purse, etc. So in GA, I guess it don't matter.

Heres the law you are talking about

Georgia Code 16-11-128

(a) A person commits the offense of carrying a pistol without a license when he has or carries on or about his person, outside of his home, motor vehicle, or place of business, any pistol or revolver without having on his person a valid license issued by the judge of the probate court of the county in which he resides, provided that no permit shall be required for persons with a valid hunting or fishing license on their person or for persons not required by law to have hunting licenses who are engaged in legal hunting, fishing, or sport shooting when the persons have the permission of the owner of the land on which the activities are being conducted; provided, further, that the pistol or revolver, whenever loaded, shall be carried only in an open and fully exposed manner.

 

[sturmruger]

I think opean carry is perfectly safe. It is not always the smartest thing to do. While it is technically legal here in WI I plan to be very choosey where I excersise this right.

 

[mustanger98]

TFW, That's a small part of the law printed on the back of our carry permits. There's more to it. I'll have to find my copy and post it. Local attitudes do come into play though. I've heard the sheriff here don't care if folks carry in town, but I also know I was in contact with a lady county magistrate within the last few years- thought she might have been Miss Right, but, oh well- anyway, while she said she was around folks who carried open when out and about (riding horses or knocking around the swamps down there) she was scared of the idea of people carrying concealed because you don't know who's carrying. I told her the whole idea of CCW was to not let the criminals know who's packing, and while she couldn't disagree with that, she couldn't seem to readily reconcile that with her other fear. She was mostly into deer hunting with archery and rifles though.

Something I've always noticed in this part of the law:

provided that no permit shall be required for persons with a valid hunting or fishing license on their person or for persons not required by law to have hunting licenses who are engaged in legal hunting, fishing, or sport shooting when the persons have the permission of the owner of the land on which the activities are being conducted;

This part about

provided, further, that the pistol or revolver, whenever loaded, shall be carried only in an open and fully exposed manner.

is pursuant to the above.

 

[mustanger98]

Okay I found what I was looking for.

http://www.state.ga.us/cgi-bin/pub/ocode/ocgsearch?docname=OCode/G/16/11/126

16-11-126 G
*** CODE SECTION *** 12/03/01

16-11-126.

(a) A person commits the offense of carrying a concealed weapon when
such person knowingly has or carries about his or her person, unless
in an open manner and fully exposed to view, any bludgeon, metal
knuckles, firearm, knife designed for the purpose of offense and
defense, or any other dangerous or deadly weapon or instrument of
like character outside of his or her home or place of business,
except as permitted under this Code section.

(b) Upon conviction of the offense of carrying a concealed weapon, a
person shall be punished as follows:

(1) For the first offense, he or she shall be guilty of a
misdemeanor; and

(2) For the second offense, and for any subsequent offense, he or
she shall be guilty of a felony and, upon conviction thereof,
shall be imprisoned for not less than two years and not more than
five years.

(c) This Code section shall not permit, outside of his or her home,
motor vehicle, or place of business, the concealed carrying of a
pistol, revolver, or concealable firearm by any person unless that
person has on his or her person a valid license issued under Code
Section 16-11-129 and the pistol, revolver, or firearm may only be
carried in a shoulder holster, waist belt holster, any other
holster, hipgrip, or any other similar device, in which event the
weapon may be concealed by the person's clothing, or a handbag,
purse, attache case, briefcase, or other closed container. Carrying
on the person in a concealed manner other than as provided in this
subsection shall not be permitted and shall be a violation of this
Code section.

(d) This Code section shall not forbid the transportation of any
firearm by a person who is not among those enumerated as ineligible
for a license under Code Section 16-11-129, provided the firearm is
enclosed in a case, unloaded, and separated from its ammunition.
This Code section shall not forbid any person who is not among those
enumerated as ineligible for a license under Code Section 16-11-129
from transporting a loaded firearm in any private passenger motor
vehicle in an open manner and fully exposed to view or in the glove
compartment, console, or similar compartment of the vehicle;
provided, however, that any person in possession of a valid permit
issued pursuant to Code Section 16-11-129 may carry a handgun in any
location in a motor vehicle.

(e) On and after October 1, 1996, a person licensed to carry a
handgun in any state whose laws recognize and give effect within
such state to a license issued pursuant to this part shall be
authorized to carry a handgun in this state, but only while the
licensee is not a resident of this state; provided, however, that
such licenseholder shall carry the handgun in compliance with the
laws of this state.

 

[Smurfslayer]

Strangely enough...

I hear phrases like this more from the "so called" pro gun people...

"I personally don’t agree with open carry for several reasons" ...

than I ever hear of in the papers, or from antis, or just people in general.

www.bighammer.net
...

Been open carrying for years, and it will probably be that way well into the future. Would I prefer to be concealed? You betcha. HOWEVER, I am not going to be disuaded from exercising my rights to bear arms, and provide for my own defense simply because the General Assembly of Virginia feels that it isn't proper to conceal firearms where alcohol is consumed. Nor will I be deterred by the alleged "moral high ground" among us - and I'm not singling anyone out here - who see open carry as some sort of burden.

As Hightech has sagely pointed out, in Virginia there is a clear cut choice at restaurants which serve alcohol.

1 - open carry, be a responsible citizen.
2 - concealed carry, break the law, it's for the commoners anyway.
3 - go unarmed, what's the chances someone's going to mug you?

So you can make all the tactical, and profound proclamations like "I'll never open carry" all you want but it's a very real choice that we face here in VA.

Then there's the "bad for our movement" argument. Numbers don't lie. In VA they went after carry and open carry last year, we shot it down. Then there was Champps, plus Reston Town Center, and Starbucks. This year, they went for open carry and got shot down HARDER this time. Lots of civil obedience, lots of open carry in VA and what happened?

Pro crime bills that became law = zero
Pro rights bills that became law = <anybody got a count? it was several>


"Frankly I don’t want any one to know, I’m carrying, period!"
...
and yet you post as much on a public gun board...

If people want to be good little sheep and hope for the best with 911 if anything bad goes down, more power to them. If open carry isn't your thing, also, more power to you. It is your right in Virginia to exercise, or not.
If you choose not to, don't do it. But please don't attempt to pontificate to those who do.


When feeling nostalgic, reach for the classics:

"Suppose you're standing in line at a bank and an armed robber comes in..."

Of the hundreds of BILLIONS of times this has occurred in the history of the republic, how many times do you estimate this has been an issue?

More importantly, other than Hollywood, when was the last time this happend? Statistically, you stand a better chance of being struck by lightning 3 times in one day from 3 separate storms. roughly...

Hightech was also right about pointing out how few people actually notice. I've had the privilege of dining with Hightech more than once - and may I say he has fine taste in wheel guns - and most people don't give us or the guns a second look.

This issue seems to divide gun owners who carry in a similar way that the 'so called' assault weapons ban divided the 'duck hunter faction' of the NRA from the NRA-ILA crowd who know that they're really homeland defense rifles.
The problem with both the 'so called AWB' restrictions, and open carry condescension is that it artficially shifts the debate further towards the side of the pro-crime crowd. Folks like Brady, VPC etc. read comments like "I'll never open carry" from a so called pro-rights person and gleefully burst out in laughter. These pro-criminal clowns want to take away all of our rights, not just people who open carry, and they'll use ANY issue they can to drive a wedge between gun owners at any chance they get. We shouldn't give them that opportunity...

My few pieces of eight.

 

[TallPine]

I agree about people not noticing. For example, yesterday the following occurred while I was openly armed with a 357 in a hip holster:

1) stood out in the road for a half hour talking with the guy who cuts trees for the power company

2) a neighbor came over to retrieve a horse trailer that we had borrowed - of course we had to talk for at least a half hour in the process

3) I went to another neighbor's place with my daughter to look at an old horse trailer that she had for sale

None of the thsoe folks gave any appearance of noticing - if they noticed, they didn't even bat an eye.

YMMV