PSA Resurrecting the STG-44

I put down money for the HMG STG - and waited, and waited. I was in regular verbal and written contact with the guys. I ended up getting a refund a ways into the project, knowing there would always be another excuse. I had always said I would buy an STG copy if someone ever thought to build one, which is why I held on as long as I did. That stupid .22 version floating around doesn't even come close to counting.:neener:

I sincerely hope this project bears some fruit but at this point I'm not holding out any hope until I see them in stock or in person.

For those that are unfamiliar, the HMG STG is/was offered in 4 calibers - .300 Blackout, 5.56, 7.62x39 and 8mm Kurz. These are swappable between the same "lower" so in theory you could have a 4-cartridge weapon. The magazines were plastic last I knew. This was done because of some issue (I can't remember) making metal mags. The gun also featured a threaded barrel and a few other features that aren't found on a real StG, but I never cared about that personally - close enough is good enough for me in this case!

And for the doubters I'm this thread, not only does PPU make live 8mm Kurz ammo, they also make and sell the brass and bullets. I should know since I have around 500 of each in my basement still!;)
 
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I can't figure out how to post the link, but PSA put out a YTube video a few days ago stating this project is still a go and they hope to have the first production models for sale sometime this year.
The video shows a pre-production model that looks pretty good, though there are some obvious differences from the German guns.

Price point will be key, I think. If they can keep the MSRP under $1500, I think they will sell well.

I'm interested in one chambered for 7.62x39 or .30 Carb, probably not so much 5.56 or 8x33.
 
NIGHTLORD40K said:
I can't figure out how to post the link, but PSA put out a YTube video a few days ago stating this project is still a go and they hope to have the first production models for sale sometime this year.
The video shows a pre-production model that looks pretty good, though there are some obvious differences from the German guns.

Price point will be key, I think. If they can keep the MSRP under $1500, I think they will sell well.

I'm interested in one chambered for 7.62x39 or .30 Carb, probably not so much 5.56 or 8x33.
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youtu.be

STG-44 update!

Watch this short video for a production update on our STG-44!
youtu.be youtu.be
 
NIGHTLORD40K said:
I can't figure out how to post the link, but PSA put out a YTube video a few days ago stating this project is still a go and they hope to have the first production models for sale sometime this year.
The video shows a pre-production model that looks pretty good, though there are some obvious differences from the German guns.

Price point will be key, I think. If they can keep the MSRP under $1500, I think they will sell well.

I'm interested in one chambered for 7.62x39 or .30 Carb, probably not so much 5.56 or 8x33.
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Mac from Hill & Mac Gunworks has already publicly stated (most recently at Shot Show) that the new ones from PSA will cost more than the HMG ones. Those ones were right around $1,600, so I would doubt the PSA version will be less. These won't exactly fly off the shelves at that price.

Also, they feed from STANAG mags, so .30 Carbine isn't likely. The gas system is optimized for the 4 calibers that they offer and they spent a great deal of time and effort getting it to do that. HMG had videos on all this years ago but I don't have the time or energy to track them down.
 
I’m excited about it. While it isn’t an original, I’ll still buy one as the originals are all but impossible to find and outrageously priced due to their rarity and machinegun status.

All that said, I remain doubtful that it will ever come to market. PSA routinely reveals projects that they’re working on, but those projects do not always come to fruition. For example, during the 2020 Shot Show, PSA made mention of a Dragunov and Krinkov. Four years later, the Krinkov might be coming out, but I have not heard anything about the Dragunov, which leads me to believe that PSA scrapped that project.

And then we have the PSA5, which PSA appeared to be close to devolving and releasing. However, they appear to have scrapped that project. I suspect that the PSA5 timing was off. For example, when they began development, there were few competitive options available. It was basically HK’s offering ($3k) and custom boutique clones ($2k+), all of which were rather uncommon. Soon into the PSA5’s development, we saw far more affordable options in the form of the Zenith/MKE guns ($1800) and PTR’s guns ($1600). And over the past couple years, we saw Century start importing the MKE guns ($1000-1,200) and Zenith begin its own USA manufacturing ($1200-1600). Basically, I suspect that PSA desired to provide an affordable and sustainable alternative to the few available options at the time, but as the PSA5 project continued, the additional options and the reasonable prices resulted in PSA losing a hoped-for niche.

Having said all that, many on here appear to have unfavorable opinions of PSA. I have a positive view of them. It is irritating that they don’t deliver on projects or miss timelines. However, it is not as though I have anything invested in their projects other than enthusiasm and hope. And I’ll remind folks that they have rolled out some incredible products that are both reliable and provide substantial cost savings over similar products. For instance, the Jakl, the Dagger, Rock, the Saber line, etc. are well-regarded alternatives to the SCAR, Glock 17/19, FN Five Seven, and premium ARs. My advice is to curb your enthusiasm for a PSA product until it actually shows up as “in stock” on their site. Assume that other items are just projects that will not be released, at least not in the near future.
 
If this is eventually brought to market it will be a novelty.

SHOT will provide more information about production and if it is put out on the range before the show we'll see how it behaves.
 
Watching the link, you can appreciate it's made in one piece of steel not stamped (even better). Let's be honest sometimes we buy some tools, toys we don't need but we do anyway. I will bite one after kirks are polished by PSA.
 
someguy2800 said:
I’m skeptical they will get it to market but I hope they do. Still waiting for the mp5 and micro dagger.
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There's something like a half dozen companies selling MP5 clones now. I don't think PSA is special enough to warrant wishing they would bring one to market when you can just get one from Zenith or Century or whoever.
 
What is the appeal, and practically how many could PSA sell?

Where is the demand for a replica of a rifle that was never made by anyone else, has been eclipsed for seventy years, and uses plastic magazines? It won’t be authentic or cheap. I don’t see the point.
 
goon said:
What is the appeal, and practically how many could PSA sell?

Where is the demand for a replica of a rifle that was never made by anyone else, has been eclipsed for seventy years, and uses plastic magazines? It won’t be authentic or cheap. I don’t see the point.
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The appeal is that its a non-AR historically cool model of rifle in a market that is extremely saturated with ARs.

Most people buying these aren't buying them as their first rifle or as a rifle to get anything done with - its a neat conversation piece. Which honestly probably 90% of the rifles bought today are just for fun at the range anyways.

TFB.tv's Shot Show video on announcing these last year was their most viewed video in the channel's history - there's plenty of interest. How many they sell will depend on final pricing, but I'd wager it'll be quite a few.
 
goon said:
What is the appeal, and practically how many could PSA sell?

Where is the demand for a replica of a rifle that was never made by anyone else, has been eclipsed for seventy years, and uses plastic magazines? It won’t be authentic or cheap. I don’t see the point.
Click to expand...

Video game people and WW2 history buffs I imagine. I have not had a chance to fire an STG44 but I have had the opportunity to examine and field strip an original. If you have ever looked at an AK47 and said this is nice but I wish it was heavier and had an awkward grip angle and looked like it was made in a shovels factory, then an original STG44 might be for you. I'm curious how the PSA will compare. I wouldn't be that interested in it unless it was full auto. Might be a cool range rental gun for those wanting to get the experience without forking out for 8mm kurz ammo and an original.
 
someguy2800 said:
Video game people and WW2 history buffs I imagine.
Click to expand...

That was my immediate thought, too.

I was in the LGS just the other day... and I swear they have an STG on the shelf... it's been there a while. I don't really care about it, so I never bothered to look at it specifically, so I may be seeing things.
 
rizbunk77 said:
Was the sturmgewerhr really that great of a weapon? Just a novelty? Didnt read of many russians dropping their ppsh for one. Didnt hear of any Americans ditching their thompsons or m1 carbines for one.
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They stayed in use long after WWII , were sold in mass a couple of times to different military's , and are still in use in Ukraine and the middle east . For something built with slave labor they held up pretty well .
 
codytrucker said:
They stayed in use long after WWII , were sold in mass a couple of times to different military's , and are still in use in Ukraine and the middle east . For something built with slave labor they held up pretty well .
Click to expand...

I've heard there were a ton of them in afghanastan and I've seen pictures of them in the Syrian civil war.

rizbunk77 said:
Was the sturmgewerhr really that great of a weapon? Just a novelty? Didnt read of many russians dropping their ppsh for one. Didnt hear of any Americans ditching their thompsons or m1 carbines for one.
Click to expand...

I think in concept they were probably the best thing that existed. In practice they were extremely crudely produced (or at least the one I examined was) and the germans had a hard time supplying enough ammo and reliable mags to actually capitalize on that effectiveness. The Germans were already flat out loosing the war on all fronts by the end of 1943 when the first units started getting deployed, so it was really never tested in an offensive role by a well trained and well equipped army.
 
someguy2800 said:
I've heard there were a ton of them in afghanastan and I've seen pictures of them in the Syrian civil war.



I think in concept they were probably the best thing that existed. In practice they were extremely crudely produced (or at least the one I examined was) and the germans had a hard time supplying enough ammo and reliable mags to actually capitalize on that effectiveness. The Germans were already flat out loosing the war on all fronts by the end of 1943 when the first units started getting deployed, so it was really never tested in an offensive role by a well trained and well equipped army.
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Years ago, I read an autobiography written by one of the very, very few German infantry soldiers to survive the Eastern front and eventually return home. He wrote that the initial issues of STG-44 were shipped with a quantity of ammunition in the crate- and they never received any more.
For the brief time they actually had ammo, however, the troops in his unit were very enthusiastic about the gun. He even used the Krummlauf device in combat, acknowledging it was a rather useless accessory.
Once they had exhausted their supply of 8x33, they were left scrambling to find K98s or scrounge Mosins and PPsH from Russian dead.
 
silicosys4 said:
Background
At SHOT Show 2016, Hill & Mac Gunworks (HMG) announced that they were creating a replica of the German WWII Sturmgewehr, or StG 44. Since at least 2017 they have been claiming they are close to shipping. In October 2018, after more than a year of additional delays, HMG posted an update on their website promising that “this time is different” and that they “hoped” to be shipping around March 2019. Then in December, they posted a video on Facebook revealing that they had “made some partnerships”. They also claimed that “if you have a pre-order as of today, you will have it in your hands, no matter when you ordered, no later than March”.

When March came, they said they had been delayed by quality control issues but had worked through them and were waiting on parts. Finally, in June of 2019, they posted that they were still waiting on the parts for testing. They have made no public statements since then.
Click to expand...

So...you're telling me theres a chance, yeah! :)
 
NIGHTLORD40K said:
Years ago, I read an autobiography written by one of the very, very few German infantry soldiers to survive the Eastern front and eventually return home. He wrote that the initial issues of STG-44 were shipped with a quantity of ammunition in the crate- and they never received any more.
For the brief time they actually had ammo, however, the troops in his unit were very enthusiastic about the gun. He even used the Krummlauf device in combat, acknowledging it was a rather useless accessory.
Once they had exhausted their supply of 8x33, they were left scrambling to find K98s or scrounge Mosins and PPsH from Russian dead.
Click to expand...
Had no idea what a “Krummlauf device“ was, so looked it up.

Here’s what Wiki has to say about it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krummlauf
 
rizbunk77 said:
Was the sturmgewerhr really that great of a weapon? Just a novelty? Didnt read of many russians dropping their ppsh for one. Didnt hear of any Americans ditching their thompsons or m1 carbines for one.
Click to expand...
It is a product of its time. The design is geared to reduced cost and raw material requirements. For example, like the M16/AR-15 the main spring goes into the stock, but whereas the M16/AR-15 has a tube screwed into the rear of the receiver to guide the spring, the MP-44 just has a hole drilled into the wood of the stock, no lining, no paint, just bare wood. Also, it has no butt plate, just little caps on the corners of the wood to keep the stock from splitting.

Also, something that is not generally seen is that if you look in the ejection port, the working surfaces are rather exposed.

87e77a8a916cb45880f6e320095280f9.jpg
 
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Justin said:
There's something like a half dozen companies selling MP5 clones now. I don't think PSA is special enough to warrant wishing they would bring one to market when you can just get one from Zenith or Century or whoever.
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Yeah, they missed the boat when that market was wide open, I probably wouldn't invest in developing an MP5 clone now either.

Also, the promised micro-dagger has come out, a bunch of slides and the magazine are in stock now, but the frame and complete pistols have been in and out of stock over the last couple weeks. I'm sure it's a supply and demand thing now, should calm down some in the future like the Jakl's have.

I don't understand the business case for the STG-44, as it seems like a novelty that's only really going to appeal to a limit crowd.... Very limited once you factor in the price. Maybe the thought was that the gun was already mostly designed by the vaporware company, so inputs to get it market ready would be small, and therefore the resulting small market demand wouldn't be a disaster?
 
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