RCBS Pro Chucker 5 vs Hornady LnL AP

[Mike P Wagner]

I am drawing close to retirement and hope to get back into shooting and reloading. Years ago, I reloaded 45 Colt for my Ruger Blackhawk, and really enjoyed the process. I actually enjoyed the relaoding enough that a shooting friend claimed that I wasn’t “shooting” when I went to range, I was just emptying out cartridges so I could reload them.

In those days, I reloaded with a Lyman turret press.

As I think about getting into reloading again, as am thinking of move in to a progressive press. I think that I learned a lot from the turret press, but I would like to move on for 2 reasons: the first is spee,d and the second is taht I really like mechincal machines - seeing all of the linkages, and how they get the job done. I a retiring from a career in software, and it’s really nice to see how problems are using physical mechanisms.

I am looking at the Hornady LnL AP and the RCBS Pro Chucker 5 (only because the Pro Chucker 7 is out of my price range right now). I am leaning toward the RCBS press, mostly because it looks like more expamdable - it looks like I can convert the Pro Chucker 5 to a Pro Chucker 7 if I ever want to t in the future for under $300.

I would plan to start with 5 stations - resize/de-prime, powder measure with through expander, RCBS (poweder check) lockout die, bullet seating die, and crimp die. I felt as though I had the best experience with re-loading 45 Colt with separate bullet seat and crimper dies.

At some point in the future, if I want to add a bullet feed die, I could get the Pro Chucker 7 conversion kit, and I’d have a place for the bullet feed die.

From what I can tell, it looks like the first versions of the Pro Chuckers came with a primer feed system that had issues, but they have fixed that problem. Does anyone have experience with that fix? Has the problem been corrected?

I did notice something odd about pricing. It looks like I can get the Pro Chucker 5 for under $400 on sale various places (I think I saw one for $379), and it looks like I can get a conversion kit for $285 on eBay. That makes buying a Pro Chucker 5 + a conversion kit over $100 cheaper than a Pro Chucker 7. That doens’t make sense to me. Am I mis-reading prices or something like that?

 

[Livin_Cincy]

The Hornady LNL has a History with plenty of YouTube Videos to help you fx the glitches and get it running super smooth. One issue is primer seating depth. Hornady warranties their press to flush, not below flush. Overtime a YuTuber Hornady wore and got to the point of no longer seating below flush. They told him about the warranty. He explained the below flush in many manuals and they told him they will not replace until priers do not go flush.

The RCBS has very few YouTube Videos from users. There are many problems with the original primer system that the fix is rumored to have fixed. RCBS has been good about mailing out the broken parts in quantities of (2) to owners. I found a thread once that the priming system issue is primer brand based. RCBS used the primers made by their parent company (free to them) during design. Other brands are sized differently (still in SAMMI spec) and that additional force cause the plastic to break. The plastic is used to reduce primer Kabooms.

Primer tube detonations occur on Primer Tube presses... Yes the blue ones as well. I am not sure if RCBS has had a Kaboom issue with their design. The biggest complaint is why they abandoned the primer system on the Pro 2000 with the strips. LEE has used plastic in primer parts and always avoided the tube design to avoid Kabooms.

With LEE mentioned you might want to look at their new Breech Lock Pro press do out this month. It is very simple to use and caliber changes are also very low cost. Production wise it not going to do 1,000 per hour. You will be in the 500 club per hour club.
https://leeprecision.com/auto-breech-lock-pro.html

 

[jmorris]

the first is spee,d and the second is taht I really like mechincal machines - seeing all of the linkages

Me too, best way to do that is own at least one of everything. Sure you’ll loose a little money if you are buying new machines but if you buy used at fair prices you can break even and get to use them all and keep the one you like most.

 

[GW Staar]

Me three. But I won't, buy one of everything....can't.

I'm in the same near retiring boat as you, but I jumped over the turrets and went from Rock Chucker II (40 years worth) to Progressive (Pro 2000, January, Obama's 1st year). Now with retirement imminent and new projects scarce, the new 7 station press from RCBS sounds like an interesting project.

I have a Pro Chucker 5 and a PC 5 to PC 7 conversion on the way as we speak. You missed the thread here on this forum......

I had found a 7 on sale (but back-ordered) at the same time I was convinced the 7 was now viable both in performance and cost, seeing RCBS is now offering powder dies and die plates for it without the forced inclusion of yet another powder measure! (I already have 3).

So I ordered a 7 only to have Midway cancel the back-order. That caused me to research it. Like you found I can get the 5 and the conversion for cheaper.....and get what amounts to a free 7 powder measure.......but I'm repeating myself....look at the last post of my PC7 Thread!

So in another week I will be putting together a PC5. Sorry, it won't stay 5 stations....I did not order a PC5 shell plate that'd be a waste.....I already have a 5 station.

I'm not an expert on the Hornady press.....somes like the Lock-N-Load somes don't. I like the tool heads used my RCBS, started by Dillon. Just more convenient in my mind. Others disagree. TETO.

Below is a vid I found on YouTube from former LnL user.......I think he goes along with jmorris...done Lee, Hornady, and now RCBS. No telling why not Dillon in there. For me it was strictly feature sets and what I personally thought I needed at the time. The fellow below keeps saying "smooth" to describe his Pro Chucker and here I thought Hornady's were "smooth" with their half step advancement mechanism, .... I will soon find out. Give me a week or two with my new project! Who knows......maybe I'll have one for sale!

 

[DRAINSMITH]

I was interested in the pro chucker 7 when about a year ago I saw a 3d rendering of the proposed case feeder. Even though the installation and adjustments are far beyond most reloader ability I would have liked to have seen them come out with it. Until they come out with a reliable case feeder it will be off my "got to have" list.

 

[GW Staar]

I have the case feeder ...... it actually came before Midway canceled my back-ordered P.C. 7 from them.....so I will be giving it a hard look as well. Looking at RCBS's feeder installation video:, I was not scared off (and I don't think I'm very far off "average") .....it looks pretty simple to install to me......we will see in a week or so.

I asked about a powered collator for it in the future. The engineer said that that's an expensive project that won't happen unless the press takes off. Such a market depends entirely on the press's market. They suggest that if you need one now get Dillon's for the 650......cheaper than Hornady's because it doesn't come with, or need to come with, the feeder. It's just a collator. Makes sense to me.

 

[Allen One1]

I'm not familiar with the RCBS but I do have the LNL. The LNL press is a lot more versatile than most people give it credit for. You can easily load rifle or pistol on it and change overs are pretty quick. For larger rifle I use it like a single stage to seat the bullets, when priming I run it like a progressive but am only running one function. The ability to pop individual dies in and out at any time is really a great feature that again adds to the presses versatility.

 

[cfullgraf]

I'm not familiar with the RCBS but I do have the LNL. The LNL press is a lot more versatile than most people give it credit for. You can easily load rifle or pistol on it and change overs are pretty quick. For larger rifle I use it like a single stage to seat the bullets, when priming I run it like a progressive but am only running one function. The ability to pop individual dies in and out at any time is really a great feature that again adds to the presses versatility.

Yes, I have different tasks that I do with my L-N-L and die positions change depending upon the task. The L-N-L bushings make that a bit more convenient since one inserts the dies into the press one at a time.

With my RCBS Pro2000, I use only one die plate, screwing the dies in and out as I do move the dies and powder measure around a little for different tasks. I do have an extra die plate or two but they remain in their original packaging.

Besides, I find storing individual dies more convenient that storing die plates with dies installed. I use RCBS or Lyman die boxes for storing my dies. Redding die boxes do not have room for the L-N-L bushing ring.

 

[GW Staar]

With my RCBS Pro2000, I use only one die plate, screwing the dies in and out as I do move the dies and powder measure around a little for different tasks. I do have an extra die plate or two but they remain in their original packaging.

Now that RCBS finally sells just the powder dies (the same one fits any RCBS press), you could un-package those die plates, screw in just pwder dies once, instead of powder measures many times....then when you want to move powder measures from one die plate to another, the depth settings permanently set on the die plate. I use to use Hornady powder dies/linkage with RCBS P.M.'s for that purpose as pictured below...but no longer have to.

Hornady Bullet feeder die is on the left.
So then I packaged the die plate and the bullet feeder parts in a Wal Mart clear storage box as pictured below.....

And stick em on a shelf....... the screwing in the dies happen only once. The P.M's just drop in the powder dies.....then all you have to change is the powder charge.

 

[GW Staar]

Now with the Pro Chuckers that come with quick change powder measures, you no longer have to adjust P.M. mics......you just buy a quick change stem that you set for a powder charge once.....and buy another for another load......if you want to of course .....you have the choice.

this is what you set once for a charge.....they are $10 a piece from the right sources.

Now maybe Mike can tell enough about the presses to decide what kind fits him best! Or we've really confused him now.....

 

[cfullgraf]

Now that RCBS finally sells just the powder dies (the same one fits any RCBS press), you could un-package those die plates, screw in just pwder dies once, instead of powder measures many times....then when you want to move powder measures from one die plate to another, the depth settings permanently set on the die plate. I use to use Hornady powder dies/linkage with RCBS P.M.'s for that purpose as pictured below...but no longer have to.

What works for me...

I size cases and expand the case mouths shortly after shooting, clean them, and store them for a future loading session so I do not rely on the powder dies for case mouth expanding. Small batches get resized quickly, less than 5 minutes for 100 cases including setting up the press. This allows me to prime off the press at a later time at no additional loss in time. I can hand prime 100 cases as fast or faster than filling a primer tubes.

I have a bunch of Hornady powder dies purchased when I first bought my L-N-L. I originally thought I needed powder dies set up for each cartridge but found out differently.

Since I do not use the powder dies for case expanding, I've found I only use one powder die with a Dillon die jam nut paired with a particular powder measure. (I use a modified Redding 10-X, RCBS Uniflow, and a Hornady L-N-L powder measure depending on what I am loading) I've made custom drop tubes that do not expand the case mouth for the various cartridges that I load. I install the appropriate drop tube in the powder die, adjust the powder measure for the case to be loaded and lock down the die with the Dillon lock net.

It takes longer to explain than to actually set the powder measure up for maximum stroke for the cartridge to be loaded.

Actually, with the Pro2000, the "one" powder die remains in the powder die position on the press most of the time and gets adjusted for the cartridge being loaded 'du jour".

Since there is little difference between the Hornady and RCBS powder dies, I've settled on the Hornady mostly because I had a drawer full of them when I bought the Pro2000. No need to buy duplicate RCBS versions and double what I already had on hand.

So, the reloading dies I use on the Pro2000, I have a locking lock ring that is set for the die plate and is installed in the press like one would use for a single stage press. Dies get installed into the die plate down to the lock nut. With the Hornady L-N-L, the dies are installed in the L-N-L bushings. Obviously, the dies are not interchangeable between presses unless I want to change the setting of the lock ring.

Also, I prefer to store dies in die boxes as opposed to having them stored in die plates. I have dies for reloading in excess of 30 different cartridges and organizing storage for 30 plus die plates would be a monumental task.

Using my method of loading on a progressive, I load more ammunition than I can shoot so I'm happy. It works for me. I do not expect it to work for others. I'm always open for suggestions and ideas, you never know when a gem of an idea passes by.

 

[cfullgraf]

Or we've really confused him now.....

Probably.

 

[thomas15]

With LEE mentioned you might want to look at their new Breech Lock Pro press do out this month. It is very simple to use and caliber changes are also very low cost. Production wise it not going to do 1,000 per hour. You will be in the 500 club per hour club.

How do you know this? Have you even seen one of these? Have you ever actually used one?

 

[frankmako]

Take a look at the dillon 550. You can do a lot with the dillon.

 

[Bang!]

Don’t own a Pro Chucker (yet) but all RCBS gear I do have is quality stuff and IMHO have the best customer service in the business.

The Breech Lock Pro from Lee is due out this month. Reviews should be out quick considering all the hype. May want to wait and see if this one is a bang or a flop. Four die positions, though. Looks like you’re wanting 5 or 7.

I also like playing with the reloading “machines”. So far have, in progressives, Dillon XL650 and 450, Hornady LnL AP, Loadmaster, and several Pro 1000’s. The Dillon and Lee machines are a lot of fun and can recommend any from those two companies. Dillon being the best.

If you get the Pro Chucker give us a review. They’re next on my tinker list. Just need to “empty some of these cartridges”.

 

[Mike P Wagner]

Take a look at the dillon 550. You can do a lot with the dillon.

At a quick glance, it looks like the 550 has four stations. I think that will make it hard to have a powder check station and a separate bullet seat and crimp, particularly if I would like to be able at some hypothetical time in the future to be able to add a bullet feed die.

Is that correct?

 

[Mike P Wagner]

Probably.

Actually, it’s been pretty helpful. One thing that occurs to me is that I don’t necessarily need to have one press to do everything - by carefully thinking about the steps, I might be able to divide the work among several presses without slowing down much. For example, on possibity that occurs to me is that I could used a single stage press for the final crimp. If I use a progressive press to size, prime, dump powder, and seat the bullet, and use a separate single stage press to crimp, there migh not be much of a time penalty. It seems to me that if I fill up a tray of rounds complete except for crimping, then crimping all of them in a single stage press would not be that time consuming.

Say it took me and hour to get 300 rounds to the “all but crimped stage” and another 10 minute to crimp all the almost completed rounds. That means that producing 300 rounds wold tale 1:15, which is 240 rounds an hour.

Using my Lyman turret press, I think that I cranked out somewhere in the neighborhood of 100 rounds an hour (maybe that’s a bit optimisitic). So getting to 240 would be a big step up.

The interesting thing is that a Hornady LnL AP plus a Hornady LnL single stage press costs much less than a Pro Chucker 7, whether thats’s the intital price of a Pro Chucker 7 or the price of Pro Chucker 4 plus the upgrade.

That stimulates me to think of what I would consider to be the “critical” steps I would like to do on a progressive press. I think what’s critical (in my mind) is the expand/powder drop, powder check, and the bullet seating. I consider the automation of those three steps to be “critical” because automating those three steps without having to pull the case off the press and put it back on should help avoid squibs or double charges.

When I was loading 45 Colt on the turret press, I would powder check each round 3 times. I used a powder measure to fill a tray of rounds (I think the trays held 50 rounds), I would pull out the flashlight and check each round in the tray top to bottom, left to right. Then I inspect each round in the tray, bottom to top, right to left. Yen I had the light arranged over my bench so that I could look into each round before I seated the bullet.

That sounds paranoid as I decsribe it, but the smokeless powder I used (except for Trail Boss) was tiny amount of powder in a very, very big case (by comparison). I don’t think powders liek Tite Group or 231 filled more than 25% of the case (but I may be miss-remembering). That may not be as much of an issue with 9mm (which is most of what I intend to reload).

The idea of an automated mechanical process that makes it much harder to accidentally skip a case seems very attractive.

Thanks for all of the info. I still have several months to go before retirement, so I have some time to think about this - maybe to overthink about this.

 

[Rule3]

What I can not understand is the pricing of the RCBS??, I have found it for $400 up to including $600+?? Most other presses (non Dillon)are a little closer or competitive in pricing.
I would buy one for $400. I had the original Pro 2000 but sold that.

 

[Livin_Cincy]

I would buy one for $400.

I found seven for $400: https://www.amazon.com/RCBS-88910-C...=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B00X02G7C0
You will have to buy a caliber specific shell plate. The PRCHKR #5 runs $80 per caliber change before dies. This is similar in price to a Blue 650 so it is not a high number.

Another option would be the Pistol Only SQDB. They work great for what they do and are very popular.

 

[Rule3]

I found seven for $400: https://www.amazon.com/RCBS-88910-C...=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B00X02G7C0
You will have to buy a caliber specific shell plate. The PRCHKR #5 runs $80 per caliber change before dies. This is similar in price to a Blue 650 so it is not a high number.

Another option would be the Pistol Only SQDB. They work great for what they do and are very popular.

Those "7" are all from Billy Bob.

How can he sell for $400 and the rest are $600 something?? (rhetorical) Something seems odd.

The Hornady LnL seems to be more evenly priced from different vendors.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B00X02G7C0/ref=dp_olp_new_mbc?ie=UTF8&condition=new

 

[frankmako]

At a quick glance, it looks like the 550 has four stations. I think that will make it hard to have a powder check station and a separate bullet seat and crimp, particularly if I would like to be able at some hypothetical time in the future to be able to add a bullet feed die.

Is that correct?

Station 1 is for sizing, depriming and priming.
Station 2 is for fairing the case and powder drop.
Station 3 is for bullet seating.
Station 4 is for crimping.

If a powder check is for you then the dillon 650 has it. I been using a dillon 550 since 1985 and have never need a powder check. Started reloading in 1973 on a single stage press and still use the same press today for rifle calibers.

I guest you could put a powder check in station 3 and use station 4 to seat and crimp bullet.

You can add a case feeder and bullet feeder to the 550. But the 650 is better suited for the case feeder and bullet feeder. I have thought about a case and bullet feeder and/or going with a 650. But there is no real reason to do so be cause the 550 is fast enough for me.

 

[Rule3]

Can a thread on presses ever NOT drift into Dillon?
The OP originally stated.:

"I am looking at the Hornady LnL AP and the RCBS Pro Chucker 5 (only because the Pro Chucker 7 is out of my price range right now). I am leaning toward the RCBS press, mostly because it looks like more expamdable - it looks like I can convert the Pro Chucker 5 to a Pro Chucker 7 if I ever want to t in the future for under $300"

 

[Mike P Wagner]

Station 1 is for sizing, depriming and priming.
Station 2 is for fairing the case and powder drop.
Station 3 is for bullet seating.
Station 4 is for crimping.

If a powder check is for you then the dillon 650 has it. I been using a dillon 550 since 1985 and have never need a powder check. Started reloading in 1973 on a single stage press and still use the same press today for rifle calibers.

I guest you could put a powder check in station 3 and use station 4 to seat and crimp bullet.

You can add a case feeder and bullet feeder to the 550. But the 650 is better suited for the case feeder and bullet feeder. I have thought about a case and bullet feeder and/or going with a 650. But there is no real reason to do so be cause the 550 is fast enough for me.

It looks like with the 550, I could not have a powder check die and a separate crimping die - and adding a bullet feed die later would be impossible.

I appreciate your experience with your 550. I am a little nervous about finding a squib or a double charge sometime when that can be really inconvenient - but that’s just my prefernce, thanks to to free maket, we an all chose what we like. I think a Dillion 650 would be quite a step up in price from a Hornady Lnl AP.

 

[GW Staar]

What I can not understand is the pricing of the RCBS??, I have found it for $400 up to including $600+?? Most other presses (non Dillon)are a little closer or competitive in pricing.
I would buy one for $400. I had the original Pro 2000 but sold that.

There's probably a secondary market ..... people willing to sell old stock at cost (if you buy all of it) while they prepare to restock with the latest run. Then the buyer sells it to move quickly on ebay. Probably has everything to do with the primer transfer bar improvement. Do I care that I get old PC5 transfer bars? No. The PC5 to PC7 upgrade has PC7 transfer bars to replace them........and if the upgrade has old PC7 bars? A quick call to RCBS will have a couple of new ones on the way free. But you want just the PC5? Then the call to RCBS applies to you too.

To Mike: It'll matter less what color you buy, if the press's features fit what you personally want to do. My first foray into this adventure, pitted the Dillon 650,550, and RCBS Pro 2000. It's hard enough to stay happy with 5 stations. the Pro2k and the Dillon 550 were initially manual advance machines.....The Pro2k advantage was you could start with manual advance and later upgrade to Dillon 650 capability with their auto-advance kit, plus it had 5 stations. The other factor was the time involved and expense of making caliber changes. RCBS was extremely fast to make the changes and much cheaper, not having to add a p.m. each time or suffer a big time penalty. Hornady? I just flat didn't want separate dies to worry about....and that's just me and what my goals were. Didn't fit me like it does Chuck.

RCBS is back to offering built-in upgrade kits.....nobody else does that......you can't change a 550 into a 650. nor a 650 into a 1050. I just wanna know if I'm going to like 7 stations....we will soon see!

 

[GW Staar]

What works for me...
Also, I prefer to store dies in die boxes as opposed to having them stored in die plates. I have dies for reloading in excess of 30 different cartridges and organizing storage for 30 plus die plates would be a monumental task.

Little note to Chuck......I obviously don't load nearly as many calibers on a progressive as you do. I have dies in boxes too.....but with those dies I load a box or two, once in a while....when I do its on the Rock Chucker. If I get a hankering to add another caliber to the Progressive Way, I buy a die plate and shell plate.....not a common thing in my cave anymore.

Mike: For me, the worse part of loading is case prep. I bought 300 rounds of MG LC .762 brass last year. It's easy to bling in a wet tumbler....done, but I'm just now finished sizing it on the Rock Chucker! That brass from hell is hard to size on that...I wasn't about to ruin a good progressive session depriming, sizing and trimming that hard stuff. Besides, it had to be swaged as well! It's Done! Took me 3 weeks with one arm!
It'll be fun to finish it off on the new press next week. One arm because the right hand is out of commission by way of carpal tunnel surgery......but hey, see, I can type pretty good. I'll be stroking the new press lefty. and right now, no more posts.....time for the hand to be iced.