Talk of Violence Amongst Radical Hispanic Activists
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Professor K
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"mike chiechi"
Member
That is scary stuff indeed. Where is that awful flyer from?
Yes, Professor K and I can buy a ton of Nazi paraphernalia at any gun show (oh, I know, it's 'collectible') or even go out to Knob Creek where they've got white supremacists recruiting in the open.
Face it - hetero white males in the United States are the single most-privileged and most-protected class in the world. That's before you even delve into economics.
People who look and sound just like us hold power at every level of government. No one is punished for being white. None of our recent ancestors were denied the ability to vote or marry whomever they damn well please. Hundreds of white men haven't been lynched.
There is not a single institutional bias against white males. No one is punished by society for being a white man.
Which isn't what he said: he (and dozens of others in the past) said 'Constitutional Rights' - to gather, to be free from harm, to due process, etc. et al.
Oh, god, not the poor put-upon white man stuff. That's what the Minutemen (etc.) need you to believe to justify their acts.
Face it - hetero white males in the United States are the single most-privileged and most-protected class in the world. That's before you even delve into economics.
People who look and sound just like us hold power at every level of government. No one is punished for being white. None of our recent ancestors were denied the ability to vote or marry whomever they damn well please. Hundreds of white men haven't been lynched.
There is not a single institutional bias against white males. No one is punished by society for being a white man.
ctdonath
Member
Yes they do.
Problem is, some won't.
The nuts move first.
Catholicism was the realm of the Irish and Italians back in the day (before all whites had to unite against people of color) - victims of the Know-Nothings (aka 'the Minutemen of the 1850s').
Today you'll find that Catholicism is strongest in precisely the communities fearmongers are attacking.
Today you'll find that Catholicism is strongest in precisely the communities fearmongers are attacking.
ctdonath
Member
Because they are very small groups with little influence.
When the Azltan types called for an ethnic strike three times last year, it happened and was felt. Atlanta wasn't shut down, but there was a discernible impact - I noticed. If a small percentage of those involved decide to pull triggers, whole cities WILL shut down.
A major (majority?) fraction of CA is inclined accordingly. With most of the CA population concentrated near the coast, and very few routes in/out of the state, it wouldn't take much more than general support of a few to annex the world's sixth largest economy into Mexico. The LA riots showed what some maniacs can do to shut down large sections of LA; imagine that scaled statewide with popular, and armed, support.
The KKK can do nothing. Wave a gun and they usually run away.
The Azltan mob thinks it's their right & destiny - and have lots of growing popular support, demonstrated effectively 3 times last year.
Additionally, their opposition is dominated by the PC "do what you want, we won't stop you (so long as you're not a white male)" philosophy.
gc70
Member
You can start with affirmative action and results test.ctdonath
Member
Work? Why work for the rich man in the nice house when you can bodily evict him and move in yourself?
The prospect of immediate social advancement with a mere wave of a gun (or pull of a trigger) can easily blot out concern of any issues of who's going to pay the bills.
You said :
Unless you don't consider the Irish, Italians, or gasp Jews.
The village of North Perry, OH was founded in 1925 by the KKK. In fact the whole stink started over what is now the village hall. At the time, it was a beachfront social club created by affluent African Americans from the Cleveland area. After creating the village and annexing their property, that problem was removed. Now the only problem was the wealthy Slovenian "papists," AKA my family. Only problem was, my great grandfather being a former Austro Hungarian cavalryman, as were most of the hired men were skilled in the use of arms and definately believed in the 2A. So please, don't tell me of the priviliged posistion of all white males.
Unless you don't consider the Irish, Italians, or gasp Jews.
The village of North Perry, OH was founded in 1925 by the KKK. In fact the whole stink started over what is now the village hall. At the time, it was a beachfront social club created by affluent African Americans from the Cleveland area. After creating the village and annexing their property, that problem was removed. Now the only problem was the wealthy Slovenian "papists," AKA my family. Only problem was, my great grandfather being a former Austro Hungarian cavalryman, as were most of the hired men were skilled in the use of arms and definately believed in the 2A. So please, don't tell me of the priviliged posistion of all white males.
What is "affirmative action"?
People throw phrases like that around, when they don't mean anything specific.
How can an abstract concept be punitive?
Even ignoring that - where are white people being screwed? Why doesn't this show up in any measure of income, educational attainment, health/longevity, child poverty, crime, etc. etc. etc..
ctdonath
Member
Nah.
Not my brother who was being pushed out of his job so his boss could get points for putting two black women in his place.
Not my friend perfectly suited for a job, told in no uncertain terms that while the best candidate for the position, his race and gender just didn't cut it.
Would you like to show me statistics placing Irish, Italians and Jews in the same socio-economic climate as those of non-European descent?
Where in America can an Irishman not get a job? Are they discriminated against in politics? Are Catholic churches burned down?
God only knows what you're arguing with this - the KKK had a stronger presence 70 years ago and acted violently toward ethnic minorities?
What that has to do with the contemporary world, I don't know.
Ah, the anecdotes start coming out.
It's funny how in every one of these stories, the white man was eminently qualified - perhaps even over-qualified - while the black person wasn't.
No white man ever lost out on a promotion because he was the lesser candidate, I guess.
Yup, I can hear the heavy, steady clomp of Art's boots off in the distance, steadily, inexorably, heading this way, all the while mumbling words and phrases his Grammaw wouldn't approve of.
Make peace with your cyber Gods, oh denizens of this doomed thread, for Art The Horrible will soon drop the www.Hammer of Doom.ouch upon our heads.
Face your fate bravely, boys...
Biker
Make peace with your cyber Gods, oh denizens of this doomed thread, for Art The Horrible will soon drop the www.Hammer of Doom.ouch upon our heads.
Face your fate bravely, boys...
Biker
gc70
Member
Last year's hiring cycle where I work is an example. There were several hundred initial applicants. After testing, the candidate pool was narrowed to about 50. When interview invitations went out, white males were excluded. Human Resources said more minorities needed to be hired.
I will never know whether the minority candidates were better qualified than the white males because I was not allowed to interview any white males.
Biker: you're right, but some things are worth defending.
ctdonath
Member
My brother had the position - not a "candidate". The switch was aborted when HR got wind of the situation, and chewed out the boss for pulling such BS.
My friend was told "it's your race & gender" to his face - not something that would be made up, considering the legal consequences.
The greater example at hand, though , is your own automatic casual dismissal of such "anecdotes".
It has everything to do with the contemporary world. These prejudices haven't disappeared.
Socio economic conditions are misleading. There is a big difference between someone who is a citizen, facing prejudice, and an illegal working under the radar. Both face prjudice, but of course the income potential of someone working under the table, and dodging la migra is going to be far less.
How many Catholic presidents have there been?
While these things are much less noticeable in todays society, they do exist. You're blanket statement of the power and privilege of all white males is absurd.
bg
Member
Cripes, L.A. is 46% or 49% hispanic now. Seems like thisCrazed_SS said:
Aztlan thing is moving right along. Appears this meeting
they had was just a few miles west of where I survive.
Wonderful.
So Human Resources felt that your company, in this anecdote, was previously biased toward whites? That it had a history of unfair hiring practices?
---
As always, the evidenciary problems of anecdotes...
But who was doing the hiring? A sympathetic guy, who was trying to explain to another white guy why he didn't get the job - 'it was the bosses, man.' Right?
---
Integrated Slovenian immigrants are still being assaulted on a regular basis? Denied basic rights and privileges?
I said nothing about illegals. I said 'people of non-European descent.' How are American Indians, Latino Americans, black Americans doing in general? How are recent Asian immigrants doing?
Approximately 1000% more than Mormon, Muslim, Jewish, etc., right?
And there is a difference in political bias and everyday bias, right?
As an atheist, I wouldn't claim that my beliefs (not being something I trumpet at all occasions) do me any meaningful harm. Were I to run for President, I'd be out of luck - but I've never lost a job because I don't believe in a god or many gods.
Isolated incidents do occur. But there is no systemic bias against any of the groups you've referred to - aside from ethnic immigrants, about whom I don't think you'll find anything I said to contradict that argument.
Art Eatman
Moderator In Memoriam
All of us have anecdotes about discrimination and reverse discrimination. What's the saying? Ah: "The plural of anecdote is not data."
Back at the time of the potato famine in Ireland when many Irish were emigrating here, they definitely were discriminated against. "Help wanted" signs in some areas also stated, "No Irish need apply."
In the early days of WW II, some stores and bars had signs prohibiting dogs and military. A solution was to pay the guys in $2 bills; the economic impact changed some thinking.
And: "It's a three-M deal." "Three-M?" "Yeah. Misdemeanor Meskin murder." How's that for an enlightened attitude?
After hours, off-the-cuff and over a beer, a personnel manager explained to a friend of mine that he was unemployable because of his age. Regardless of any law, many, many excuses are available.
If you have a history of self-employment, many private-sector companies don't want you. You will be too independent and willing to tell a superior he's wrong. Qualifications are not at issue.
IOW, it's pointless and trashy to bring up discrimination here as a bolster to any argument. Too much of it is of the "So's your old man!" thing that folks were warned against in their class on Logic. You did take that, didn't you?
Stick with the legal/political/civil rights aspects of "problems".
And come back and post after your Valium kicks in.
Art
Back at the time of the potato famine in Ireland when many Irish were emigrating here, they definitely were discriminated against. "Help wanted" signs in some areas also stated, "No Irish need apply."
In the early days of WW II, some stores and bars had signs prohibiting dogs and military. A solution was to pay the guys in $2 bills; the economic impact changed some thinking.
And: "It's a three-M deal." "Three-M?" "Yeah. Misdemeanor Meskin murder." How's that for an enlightened attitude?
After hours, off-the-cuff and over a beer, a personnel manager explained to a friend of mine that he was unemployable because of his age. Regardless of any law, many, many excuses are available.
If you have a history of self-employment, many private-sector companies don't want you. You will be too independent and willing to tell a superior he's wrong. Qualifications are not at issue.
IOW, it's pointless and trashy to bring up discrimination here as a bolster to any argument. Too much of it is of the "So's your old man!" thing that folks were warned against in their class on Logic. You did take that, didn't you?
Stick with the legal/political/civil rights aspects of "problems".
And come back and post after your Valium kicks in.
Art
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