Vista Outdoor splitting into two - Ammunition companies and Sporting Goods companies

[LiveLife]

As anticipated for some time, after being spun off ATK into Vista Outdoor in 2015, Vista Outdoor is splitting into two publicly traded companies - https://www.outdoorsportswire.com/v...to-two-independent-publicly-traded-companies/

Outdoor Products will include "Sporting Goods" companies like CamelBak, Bell, Giro, Camp Chef, Bushnell, Bushnell Golf, Foresight Sports, Stone Glacier and QuietKat, etc. Outdoor Products will be led by Chris Metz as CEO and headquartered in Bozeman, Montana.​

Sporting Products (to be renamed at a later date) will include ammunition companies [Alliant], Federal, Remington, CCI, Speer, Estate Cartridge and HEVI-Shot. Jason Vanderbrink, current President of Sporting Products, will be appointed CEO and headquartered in Anoka, Minnesota.​

Separation Overview lists benefits of better operation of companies to focus on specific industries and "benchmarking" (Quality Improvement?) to market competition - https://s29.q4cdn.com/177147254/fil.../vista-outdoor-separation-overview_vfinal.pdf

Separation Into Two Industry-leading Companies​

• Two focused, industry leading companies without the conglomerate overhang
• Each as industry-leading platforms, with their own competitive advantages and leadership economics
• Allows for clearer benchmarking to the right industry peers, and the expansion of our investor community

I sure hope this results in more available Alliant powders and CCI/Federal/Remington primers.

 

[Jim Watson]

I don't see how, without expanding their factories.
Looks more like Executives Full Employment Plan with two sets of bosses instead of one.

Also separates the nasty old gun stuff from the soft sports, so they can still sell stuff after more repression of shooters.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

I sure hope this results in more available Alliant powders and CCI/Federal/Remington primers.

Me too! The upside is the profits and losses will be segregated from the rest of operations.

 

[LiveLife]

separates the nasty old gun stuff from the soft sports, so they can still sell stuff after more repression of shooters.

That was the primary reason why the talk of splitting off ammunition companies from sporting goods companies started in the first place.

Federal has significant chunk of military/government ammunition contracts (Along with Winchester) and splitting into separate company may provide greater independence of product development and company operations without the distraction of parent company "minders" sensitive to public sentiments.

I am thinking this is positive step for us reloaders as customers of Alliant powders and CCI/Federal/Remington primers. Maybe we will see more bulk Speer Gold Dot HP and Remington Golden Saber JHP projectiles being available again. But there maybe some downside to losing a much larger parent company.

Perhaps Paul from @Alliant Reloading could shed some more light on the Vista Outdoor split.

 

[Buzznrose]

That was the primary reason why the talk of splitting off ammunition companies from sporting goods companies started in the first place.

Federal has significant chunk of military/government ammunition contracts (Along with Winchester) and splitting into separate company may provide greater independence of product development and company operations without the distraction of parent company "minders" sensitive to public sentiments.

I am thinking this is positive step for us reloaders as customers of Alliant powders and CCI/Federal/Remington primers. Maybe we will see more bulk Speer Gold Dot HP and Remington Golden Saber JHP projectiles being available again. But there maybe some downside to losing a much larger parent company.

Perhaps Paul from @Alliant Reloading could shed some more light on the Vista Outdoor split.

I would expect to hear from someone from Vista on this week’s Gun Talk Radio show on Sunday.

 

[LiveLife]

The upside is the profits and losses will be segregated from the rest of operations.

More than 100 million guns were sold in the past decade and we are still averaging 20+ million guns sold annually.

This is growing customer base with market demand for consumable ammunition with many of them becoming reloaders adding to the demand side for primers and powder.

Adding to military/government contracts, this is a booming industry with no sight of reduction in demand, only increase.

 

[CQB45ACP]

As anticipated for some time, after being spun off ATK into Vista Outdoor in 2015, Vista Outdoor is splitting into two publicly traded companies - https://www.outdoorsportswire.com/v...to-two-independent-publicly-traded-companies/

Outdoor Products will include "Sporting Goods" companies like CamelBak, Bell, Giro, Camp Chef, Bushnell, Bushnell Golf, Foresight Sports, Stone Glacier and QuietKat, etc. Outdoor Products will be led by Chris Metz as CEO and headquartered in Bozeman, Montana.​

Sporting Products (to be renamed at a later date) will include ammunition companies [Alliant], Federal, Remington, CCI, Speer, Estate Cartridge and HEVI-Shot. Jason Vanderbrink, current President of Sporting Products, will be appointed CEO and headquartered in Anoka, Minnesota.​

Separation Overview lists benefits of better operation of companies to focus on specific industries and "benchmarking" (Quality Improvement?) to market competition - https://s29.q4cdn.com/177147254/fil.../vista-outdoor-separation-overview_vfinal.pdf

Separation Into Two Industry-leading Companies​

• Two focused, industry leading companies without the conglomerate overhang
• Each as industry-leading platforms, with their own competitive advantages and leadership economics
• Allows for clearer benchmarking to the right industry peers, and the expansion of our investor community

I sure hope this results in more available Alliant powders and CCI/Federal/Remington primers.

I’ll tell you what, the general counsel at “sporting products” has a tough job but not much future.

I’ve read elsewhere the new company’s name will be “Sacrificial Lamb.”

 

[Otto]

This news was announced nearly 2 months ago.
VSTO stock has had a 10% negative return over the past year. While the S&P 500 has gained over 11%.

 

[LiveLife]

I’ve read elsewhere that new company’s name will be “Sacrificial Lamb.”

So people are going to stop wars around the world and stop committing crime in this country?

To me, record setting historic number of guns sold annually is indication that more and more people are buying and shooting guns for various reasons from sporting/matches to self-defense/practice.

Just look at primer price increase from $30 to $100 down from recent high of $150 per thousand. That's supply and demand at play and to me, demand has not stopped as likely primer manufacturers are producing as many primers as they possibly can.

VSTO stock has had a 10% negative return over the past year. While the S&P 500 has gained over 11%.

I wonder if profit numbers from Alliant powder and Federal/CCI/Remington primers went up or down during the same period.

 

[CQB45ACP]

So people are going to stop wars around the world and stop committing crime in this country?

To me, record setting historic number of guns sold annually is indication that more and more people are buying and shooting guns for various reasons from sporting/matches to self-defense/practice.

Just look at primer price increase from $30 to $100 down from recent high of $150 per thousand. That's supply and demand at play and to me, demand has not stopped as likely primer manufacturers are producing as many primers as they possibly can.


I wonder if profit numbers from Alliant powder and Federal/CCI/Remington primers went up or down during the same period.

Huh? Didn’t say the product but the company.

Writing is on the wall for the PLCAA in my view and see the finance companies losing their nerve.

I simply don’t see a sound future for any company in this market including reloading.

 

[rocirish]

I'd feel a lot better if they weren't based in a "liberal" state.

 

[CoalCrackerAl]

I think they own RCBS too.

 

[LiveLife]

Didn’t say the product but the company.

I simply don’t see a sound future for any company in this market including reloading.

OK ... That could be the case.

I'd feel a lot better if they weren't based in a "liberal" state.

Once the "Sporting Products (to be renamed at a later date)" company has full independence, it could make decision to headquarter in a state most favorable for the future viability of the company. Like Magpul moving its corporate headquarters to Texas and distribution to Wyoming.

I think they own RCBS too.

Yes, RCBS is still listed on Vista Outdoor brand page but not sure if RCBS will be included in the "Ammunition" companies or "Sporting Goods" - https://vistaoutdoor.com/brands/

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

This allows liberal/woke ESG funds to buy shares of the Outdoor Products company, where before they would not invest in Vista at all because "guns bad."
Firewalling their liability in the event of repeal (or judiciary sidestepping) of the PLCAA is just iceing on the cake. Its mostly about increasing share valuation.

Vista is also dumping most of their combined debt on the Sporting branch, so no skin off their nose if it's sued into oblivion.

As to who will make ammo for the regime's foreign adventures, Lake City Arsenal (and others) are owned by the Gubmint, the ammo companies are just contracted operators- such an entity doesn't even actually need to be involved in shooting sports at all, they just need to know how to assemble product at a fixed price. GE, GD, Lockmart or any of the other MIC players could just as well do it.

 

[Howa 9700]

This is why I made the call to start reloading for all the firearms I care about. They will have a tough time taking away guns, but if wrong sort gets control of Vista's ammo group, they can make ammo unobtainium, in which case gun become an expensive club to wave around. So made that call and have been quietly accumulating enough stash I won't run dry in my lifetime. Hope history proves me wrong, but won't matter now to me either way.

 

[Howa 9700]

Keep wondering how to keep Vista's ammo group from falling into wrong hands.........and best solution I can come up with is for it to fall into the right hands. Wondering if it would be possible for key players with vested stake in outcome......firearms companies, ammo makers, powder companies and retailers of same......form a holding company to buy out the ammo group. Individually, probably none of them could swing it, but collectively they could.

 

[kidneyboy]

Separation Into Two Industry-leading Companies

• Two focused, industry leading companies without the conglomerate overhang
• Each as industry-leading platforms, with their own competitive advantages and leadership economics
• Allows for clearer benchmarking to the right industry peers, and the expansion of our investor community

^^^^^^^^^^
Marketing 101 - How to say things that don't actually sound like the BS it actually is.

 

[CQB45ACP]

Keep wondering how to keep Vista's ammo group from falling into wrong hands.........and best solution I can come up with is for it to fall into the right hands. Wondering if it would be possible for key players with vested stake in outcome......firearms companies, ammo makers, powder companies and retailers of same......form a holding company to buy out the ammo group. Individually, probably none of them could swing it, but collectively they could.

A gazillionaire white knight on the order of Elon musk would be nice. Or at least enough juice to start a really big go fund me type grass roots effort who is a reloader.

 

[Varminterror]

Wondering if it would be possible for key players with vested stake in outcome......firearms companies, ammo makers, powder companies and retailers of same......form a holding company to buy out the ammo group.

You understand that most of the companies of the types you’re mentioning here are already held by financially focused investors, right? And equally, even when well meaning investors accept lower returns to operate based on principle, the practice is unsustainable and eventually, someone else ends up owning the business - typically a distressed capital manager, which picks the business apart to reclaim what value is left.

“Wishful thinking” doesn’t fare well in a capitalist market. Better than forming a holding company, where competition and adversaries only have ONE target, it is far better to support cultural consumerism which purchases firearms, ammo, accessories, and accoutrement, such these companies become sufficiently profitable to remain fiscally competitive in capitalist economy, and such the voting base supports policy protecting their market.

So the best way to manage Vista’s ammo business is to buy ammo, and take a buddy, who doesn’t shoot, to the range.

 

[CQB45ACP]

You understand that most of the companies of the types you’re mentioning here are already held by financially focused investors, right? And equally, even when well meaning investors accept lower returns to operate based on principle, the practice is unsustainable and eventually, someone else ends up owning the business - typically a distressed capital manager, which picks the business apart to reclaim what value is left.

“Wishful thinking” doesn’t fare well in a capitalist market. Better than forming a holding company, where competition and adversaries only have ONE target, it is far better to support cultural consumerism which purchases firearms, ammo, accessories, and accoutrement, such these companies become sufficiently profitable to remain fiscally competitive in capitalist economy, and such the voting base supports policy protecting their market.

So the best way to manage Vista’s ammo business is to buy ammo, and take a buddy, who doesn’t shoot, to the range.

It’s all dreaming anyway. We’re in the early innings of an inexorable demo shift in our population centers—I doubt there are enough buddies even if they had buddies.

But I agree with giving it a try often, very often.

 

[Varminterror]

We’re in the early innings of an inexorable demo shift in our population centers

We’ve been an urbanized country for a couple of generations already, and gun ownership really hasn’t changed much in the last ~50yrs:

 

[CQB45ACP]

We’ve been an urbanized country for a couple of generations already, and gun ownership really hasn’t changed much in the last ~50yrs:

View attachment 1158573

Sorry but let’s move on to reloading—I don’t trust someone else’s stats especially when I like em.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Sorry but let’s move on to reloading—I don’t trust someone else’s stats especially when I like em.

I’m not really reassured by the thought that fewer than half the People are armed. I am slightly reassured when I remember that more than half of respondents to such surveys lie to the survey takers.
Regardless of any speculation, pun intended, the fact is Vista has made a move to segregate its overtly and at times oppressively regulated firearms related operations from its less oppressively regulated businesses. I see that as a good thing. Other opinions vary.

 

[CQB45ACP]

I’m not really reassured by the thought that fewer than half the People are armed. I am slightly reassured when I remember that more than half of respondents to such surveys lie to the survey takers.
Regardless of any speculation, pun intended, the fact is Vista has made a move to segregate its overtly and at times oppressively regulated firearms related operations from its less oppressively regulated businesses. I see that as a good thing. Other opinions vary.

Excellent point!

But maybe that’s what they want us to believe

Actually looking forward to the upcoming NRA reloading class at the range in August. It’ll show a heretofore unknown (to me) relative level of interest here in the people’s republic of Fairfax.

 

[Rule3]

If it was not for the near monopoly on primers I have no use for VISTA and their conglomeration of companies.
Powder and reloading presses are available with out them.