WIN 231 vs Titegroup in 9mm

[MWC1974]

I’m going to open one of the two and haven’t used either. I’ve gone through a few pounds of N320 and have two pounds left, but wanted to try 231 or Titegroup. Thought I would see what others opinions might be.

I have quite a bit of Berrys 115s and Hosier (Coated) 124s that I need to use up, so those will be the two projectiles. Loads will be strictly for plinking and will be from published data.

I would love your thoughts, opinions, and experience with either or both of the powders.

Thanks in advance,
Matt

 

[Hartkopf]

I like 3.9grs Titegroup with Berry’s 124grn CPRN. It’s a clean powder and great for plinking.

 

[ben293]

I don’t have any experience with Titegroup, but I started my reloading adventures with 231 and have come back to it for 9mm and 38 special. Meters well, shoots well.

 

[CoalCrackerAl]

I like T.G for plated and FMJ. I still have part of a lb of 231 from 2017. Just never did much with it. Although today i loaded some 32 H&R 115 cast with it.

 

[MWC1974]

I like 3.9grs Titegroup with Berry’s 124grn CPRN. It’s a clean powder and great for plinking.

Thats the load I use but with N320 for my 124s

 

[ballman6711]

I can't speak about 9mm since I don't load for it, but I have used both N320 and W231 in my 45acp 1911.

My experience is that N320 seemed to burn a bit cleaner, left my gun a bit cleaner, but had the same accuracy as the W231. Loads were using 185gr coated and plated bullets.

chris

 

[Soonerpesek]

reloading adventures with 231 and have come back to it for 9mm and 38 special. Meters well,

Don't have any input on Titegroup, but 231 does meter exceptionally well......

 

[MWC1974]

I can't speak about 9mm since I don't load for it, but I have used both N320 and W231 in my 45acp 1911.

My experience is that N320 seemed to burn a bit cleaner, left my gun a bit cleaner, but had the same accuracy as the W231. Loads were using 185gr coated and plated bullets.

chris

Agree wholeheartedly, N320 is pretty clean stuff. Just looking to change things up for a bit.

 

[Nature Boy]

I’m using 4.3gn of HP-38(win 231) with both plated and FMJ 124s

 

[enine]

win231 works fine, no issues, but Tightgroup lives up to its name, I do get tighter groups from it.

 

[Y-T71]

I prefer 231 over Titegroup if, for no other reason, I've burned up pounds of it over the last 30+ years.

I was "gifted" 1lb of Titegroup a couple of years ago and it sat around for those years because I couldn't think if anything to do with it that 231 wasn't already doing.

Eventually I came up with a nice .38slp plinking load with home cast 125gr RNFP.

Because of the light charges involved, "free" bullets and the fact that I am flush with SPP, I could shoot my .38's cheaper than .22 rimfire!

Only 2 "downsides" for me are 1: it's scorches my brass (minor) and 2: it burns really hot.
Again it's minor for me in my revolvers but in an automatic it'll heat your pistol up really quick.

Also, FWIW, it's been said that, because of it's high nitro content it'll turn powder coated bullets bases into goo but I personally haven't found that to be the case.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I'm a huge fan of W231. I load not handgun cartridges with it. You won't be sorry...

 

[kidneyboy]

I load coated 124gr with 3.7gr of Titegroup. This has become my standard 124gr 9mm load. However, it's hard to go wrong with W231.

 

[Random 8]

I have loaded both, with 124 grain coated, cast/lubed and jacketed. I got a slight burnt look from the TG loads, but good accuracy. The only real difference I noted was more positive ejection and chambering in colder weather with the 231 loads in a handgun known for hiccups. In my case I was using HP38, but it is my understanding they are identical.

 

[Slamfire]

David Sams recommended Power Pistol for his 2700 Bullseye Pistol Berrettas.

M92 FS Beretta Bar Sto Barrel 

115 Full Metal Case Master Factory Ammo  
 20-Jun-09 T = 90 °F  

Ave Vel = 1180    
Std Dev = 10.19   
ES = 33.27   
High = 1197   
Low = 1167   
Number rounds = 8   

115 gr RMR Plated RN 6.0 grs Power Pistol lot 3-16 WSP OAL 1.150"  Mag Length
15-Sep-16 T = 94 °F  crimp 0.375" 

Ave Vel = 1175   
Std Dev = 22   
ES = 81   
Low = 1130   
High = 1211   
N = 20   

Very accurate   

115 gr XTP Hornady HP 0.355" 6.0 grs Power Pistol lot 3-16 WSP OAL 1.10"
15-Sep-16 T = 95 °F  crimp 0.375" 

Ave Vel = 1161    
Std Dev = 54    
ES = 197    
Low = 1111    
High = 1308    
N = 11    
Very accurate but rounds would not feed, jammed on barrel ramp.  One jammed bullet deep seated on feed ramp. Produced 1247 fps, not included in data


115 gr FMJ Hornady 0.355" 6.0 grs Power Pistol lot 3-16 WSP OAL 1.15"
15-Sep-16 T = 95 °F  crimp 0.375" 

Ave Vel = 1187     
Std Dev = 16     
ES = 58     
Low = 1157     
High = 1215     
N = 9   

v accurate.     


115 gr RMR Plated RN 4.2 grs Titegroup lot 4-16 WSP OAL 1.150"  Mag Length
15-Sep-16 T = 95 °F  crimp 0.375" 

Ave Vel = 1092   
Std Dev = 20   
ES = 73   
Low = 1065   
High = 1138   
N = 16   
very accurate       

115 gr FMJ Hornady 0.355" 4.2 grs Titegroup lot 4-16 WSP OAL 1.15"
15-Sep-16 T = 95 °F  crimp 0.375" 

Ave Vel = 1108    
Std Dev = 26    
ES = 75    
Low = 1074    
High = 1149    
N = 9

 

[9mmepiphany]

I've used both before and don't use either anymore. Neither will be as nice as N320

Titegroup burns hot, is dirty, and has a very narrow operating band (not much range between starting and max charges). It is hard to see in cases when checking powder level and will tend to etch your plastic powder measure body if left overnight.

W231/HP-38 (they are identical except for price) is very versatile in 9mm, .38Spl and .45ACP. It meters well and is easy to see in cases. It's big drawback is that it is temperature sensitive.

 

[derek45]

Both TG and win231/HP38 work fine with 124 9mm

TG will heat the gun up faster, but you need less. with some coated bullets it can be smokey and give off a burning smell.

231 is a great "all around" pistol powder

 

[lordpaxman]

In my experience, for a given bullet, you need less TG than N320 to achieve a given velocity, but the felt recoil impulse from TG is sharper. TG is precise and accurate, just be extra careful with it. 231 is a good fast powder as well. I shot my last match with my N320 load.
If I didn’t have N320, I’d be using TG first, and 231 second if those were the choices. If you flipped a coin, you wouldn’t lose either way.

 

[Charlie98]

Titegroup burns hot, is dirty, and has a very narrow operating band (not much range between starting and max charges). It is hard to see in cases when checking powder level and will tend to etch your plastic powder measure body if left overnight.

+1... including etching my powder hopper.

As much as I don't like TiteGroup, it's a pretty good 9mm powder. Oddly enough, although I've used W231 in .45ACP, I've never tried it in 9mm.

 

[Skgreen]

It's hard to go wrong with either one in this case, so get both. TG for plated / 38 for coated. Experiment if you think that one might be advantageous over the other.

FWIW, I recently shot TG + 125 HAP through a suppressed Ruger PC9. Liked what I saw (and didn't hear) enough to want to load more of the same.

 

[rfwobbly]

• W231 (also sold as Hodgdon HP-38) was for decades the best selling powder. Generally speaking, it can be used in almost any handgun cartridge. It is a moderate burn rate, meters very accurately with excellent case fill in auto pistol cartridges and good case fill in revolvers. The wide load range and moderate speed (read as "very forgiving") make it an excellent powder for beginners. The load range in 9mm is about 1.2gr. You will not typically find published load data for W231 and 147gr in 9mm due to the very restricted load range, but for 115, 124 and 135gr it's excellent.

• Titegroup is a very dense, very fast/hot burning powder. Its main selling point is its low price for those who consume a lot of powder. Because of its very fast burn rate, the load range in 9mm is held to 0.4gr. (At least 3 times more narrow than W231 !) For that reason, it is not very forgiving of errors and may require a more accurate powder measure and/or loading technique. Due to density, case fill in 9mm is OK, but in 38Spcl or 357M it may be "position sensitive". That is, accuracy and velocity can become highly dependent on the dispersal of TG within the spacious revolver case.

• Better than both of these is Alliant Sport Pistol. It has all the fine qualities of W231, with a tad faster burn rate which gives it greater accuracy for target or competition shooting, especially in 9mm.
.

 

[Steve51]

No experience with Titegroup but have used a lot of W231 & HP-38 for 9mm, .38 Spl, .357 magnum lighter loads, .44 Spl, and .44 magnum lighter loads. Don't use them for rifle loads, just handgun loads.

 

[Bill M.]

Two good powders to have to choose between.

 

[9mmepiphany]

Better than both of these is Alliant Sport Pistol. It has all the fine qualities of W231, with a tad faster burn rate which gives it greater accuracy for target or competition shooting, especially in 9mm.

I have to agree with this.

I first tried Sport Pistol as a replacement for N320 and it worked pretty well...my other preference is e3

 

[JEBruns]

Two good powders to have to choose between.

Agreed. I have burned up a bunch of both of those powders with 9mm, and would be hard pressed to pick a winner. The recoil impulse is a bit lower with the 231, so my wife prefers it for that reason.