Worry about mag springs?

K

KyJim

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Jan 20, 2007
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Location
Kentucky
Perhaps you’re worried too much. Ammunitiontogo.com tested various mag springs and found all the tested mags worked well after 270 cycles (equal to 8,000 rounds through a PMag). They also had a lab cycle the springs on a Glock 17 mag and a 30-round PMag until the springs failed—over 250,000 round equivalent for the Glock mag and over two million through a Gen3 PMag.

Of course there other reasons for a mag to fail, but this should put to rest any concerns about long term storage of loaded mags. I’ve only touched on the results and recommend reading the article for yourself.
https://www.ammunitiontogo.com/lodg...sletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=4_13_23
 
People don't seem to worry about cycling the springs, they're worried about storing them.
Which is exactly the opposite it should be.
Good modern magazines are designed with the springs' limits in mind. Barring crappy manufacturing, if a magazine is designed for 10 rounds, 12, 15, 20, 30, whatever, it's fine to load and store that many in it.
The only reason springs are going to take a 'set' is from heat (unlikely) and oxidation affecting them, and there's a considerable tolerance there. Don't abuse them and you're fine.

People should be more worried about the lip, and that's not at all an issue with steel magazines. Even good polymer ones will be fine for years.
 
the only springs I've ever seen lose any tension were 70 years old. in two minutes I just stretched the spring out again by hand and they have worked fine ever since. one was a magazine spring, the other was the spring for a tube fed .22 ... I could have taken the time to replace them, but it was quicker to just stretch them out a bit quick and move on.
 
I've only ever seen one Magazine spring fail and that was on an actual usgi 1911 magazine. I got it secondhand I have no idea what it's provenance was it could have been 40 or 50 years old.
 
When I was running an XD-40 Tactical in USPSA competition I replaced my magazine springs at about every 15-20k rds (spread across 12 magazines). I knew it was time when I would start getting the occasion bolt over base malfunction in the last couple rounds in the magazine. XD-40 Magazine not truly being a double stack magazine (stuffing 40 in a 9mm width magazine body) made them a bit more reliant on stiff magazine springs that true double stack magazines. The recoil spring I replaced about every 4000,-5000 rds but I was running a very light recoil spring and it did not take much lost in stiffness before the recoil spring was unable to hold the slide in battery against the striker spring. If I could shake the gun out of battery I replaced the recoil spring but they were cheap and easy to get having converted my XD-40 to use 1911 recoil springs.
 
I’ve always subscribed to the “less wear if they they stay loaded” camp. And generally, I don’t worry about it. However, I kept a few MecGar CZ75 Compact mags loaded for a few years. I went to use them and found that 4/6 would just dump the ammo after the first couple rounds. Literally no spring action. I replaced with Wolfe springs and now the mags are fine….though that 14th round is a bear.
 
Unfortunately I woke up one day recently and suddenly realized I’ve been doing this for a long time. :(.

Sigh, at any rate in those “lost years”. :(. The only real problem I’ve seen is failures to lock open as a spring starts to loose some of its ….”sproing”. :). I mean yes I have seen horribly used and worn mags cause actual issues but those have been few and far between. As a general rule I’ve found the vast majority of mags to be pretty robust and long lasting assume there wasn’t some kind of failure at manufacture.

Like pretty much every gun guy I did worry a bit about springs early on as well as a polymer but I don’t really give it a second thought these days. Most of the stuff I’ve seen go wrong in general were things I’d have never expected. (For example the welds on a Colt mag giving out and launching its contents in the wrong direction …… which I have to say the spring worked great that day. :).
 
SSN Vet said:
Robert Hooke had something to say on the subject...

View attachment 1145962

It's all about specifying the right metal and good design. Stay below the elastic limit and you're good to go.
Click to expand...
The problem is: you cannot design a magazine spring that is not working around point "B". They will all eventually take a set. The difference between a good magazine spring design and a bad magazine spring design is after taking a set, is the spring is still within the range of reliable operation . . .
 
I’ve had to replace at least 20 mag springs in the past 20 years. Magazine springs are man made, and can thus, fail. And every mag is designed differently and some mags compress the spring further and closer to their elastic limit.

My defensive mag springs (Glock) get replaced every three years. I don’t purchase mag springs. It’s actually cheaper to sell the used mags and replace them with new, so that’s what I do. Only cost perhaps 3 bucks per mag to replace them every three years.
 
I have a lot of around 15 or so Korean KCI Glock mags Ive been using on a weekly basis since 2009 or so as my practice mags. Still going strong too and no signs of trouble yet. I keep the factory mags what come wit the gus for serious use, and let the Korean mags take the beating and abuse of constant practice. At this point too, I wouldnt have any issues using them for serious use either.

I also have a lot of around 20 or so 1911 mags that Ive accumulated over the past 50 years or so. Mostly Colt, GI, but also a mix of Wilson, and a few others.

The GI mags are starting to go at a pretty steady rate now, and its not the springs, but the bodies themselves. The fronts of the mags are cracking/splitting from top to bottom.

The springs on the 8 round Colt mags I have seem to going now, and most of those dont lock back on empty. Dont remember when I got them, but they are probably around 30 years old or so now.

Ive got a bunch of Colt and GI AR mags Ive been using on a regular basis since the early 70's that still have the original springs and followers in them and they still seem fine. They dont get used a while lot anymore these days though, the Magpuls get the heavy use and abuse there.
 
KyJim said:
Perhaps you’re worried too much. Ammunitiontogo.com tested various mag springs and found all the tested mags worked well after 270 cycles (equal to 8,000 rounds through a PMag). They also had a lab cycle the springs on a Glock 17 mag and a 30-round PMag until the springs failed—over 250,000 round equivalent for the Glock mag and over two million through a Gen3 PMag.

Of course there other reasons for a mag to fail, but this should put to rest any concerns about long term storage of loaded mags. I’ve only touched on the results and recommend reading the article for yourself.
https://www.ammunitiontogo.com/lodg...sletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=4_13_23
Click to expand...
So, in other words, springs operated like springs? They generally don't fail except from lots of use or over stretch.
 
....ain't never worried about mag springs. When a mag quits workin' I just get a new one. But.....for the life of me, kain't remember one ever wearing out. Have had some that never worked right from the get go tho........
 
lysanderxiii said:
The problem is: you cannot design a magazine spring that is not working around point "B". They will all eventually take a set. The difference between a good magazine spring design and a bad magazine spring design is after taking a set, is the spring is still within the range of reliable operation . . .
Click to expand...

I tell all the young engineers I've trained that every design decision they ever make is a compromise between competing priorities. In the case of a magazine, the end user wants to stuff as many bullets into as little space as possible... leaving very little room for the mag spring in it's compressed state. But the spring still needs to push the follower all the way to the top, with enough force left over to ensure reliable feeding. Extending the follower legs to keep the spring within the elastic limit (and preserving its life) could be done, but then you'd go bankrupt as all the stat chasers would buy the competition's mag, that advertised a capacity of one more round.

Yet I believe that the USMC still trains their riflemen to download their M-4/16 mags to prolong life and ensure reliable feeding.
 
SSN Vet said:
I tell all the young engineers I've trained that every design decision they ever make is a compromise between competing priorities. In the case of a magazine, the end user wants to stuff as many bullets into as little space as possible... leaving very little room for the mag spring in it's compressed state. But the spring still needs to push the follower all the way to the top, with enough force left over to ensure reliable feeding. Extending the follower legs to keep the spring within the elastic limit (and preserving its life) could be done, but then you'd go bankrupt as all the stat chasers would buy the competition's mag, that advertised a capacity of one more round.

Yet I believe that the USMC still trains their riflemen to download their M-4/16 mags to prolong life and ensure reliable feeding.
Click to expand...

I don't believe downloading has anything to do with magazine spring life but to ensure the magazine locks reliably into the mag-well when inserted on a closed bolt.
 
mcb said:
I don't believe downloading has anything to do with magazine spring life but to ensure the magazine locks reliably into the mag-well when inserted on a closed bolt.
Click to expand...

I've heard both reasons cited...

lysanderxiii said:
No one ever taught me to download. They said it held 30, they told me to put 30 in it...
Click to expand...

My source of information on this is a co-worker who is in the USMC active reserves and is a qualified marksmanship coach. He knows his way around the platform very well.
 
You do realize there are more than two companies out there that make magazines? Makers are spread out across the entire world using different metallurgy too.

I'll continue to change all springs at routine intervals.
 
SSN Vet said:
My source of information on this is a co-worker who is in the USMC active reserves and is a qualified marksmanship coach.
Click to expand...

That doesn't make his opinion official United States Marine Corps Doctrine. I was in the Army for 15 years I was never told to download a magazine. I've never seen it in the -10 for an M16(A1,A2 or A3) either.
 
Yeah.... So I have left both a Mossberg 500 and a Henry Big Boy fully loaded, only to find the mag springs became too weak to push out the last few without the help of gravity.

The one Ruger GSR Scout 10-round polymer mag I left loaded also isn't doing so hot.

I trust my Glock mags to stay fully loaded and keep pushing, but some long gun magazines are really questionable.
 
I had a USP 45 Tactical that had the worst mags. Springs required constant replacement & maintainence. HK factory literature says just to pull them back out (!!!) I got rid of it. You would think $60 mags should work right.
 
Night Rider said:
That doesn't make his opinion official United States Marine Corps Doctrine. I was in the Army for 15 years I was never told to download a magazine. I've never seen it in the -10 for an M16(A1,A2 or A3) either.
Click to expand...

I'm not talking about opinions, and unlike many others, I don't just make $#it up. It's what he was taught, and what he was told to teach other marines on the range.

The corp has always had their own way of doing things. Perhaps there are other jar heads (term used with affection and respect) that could chime in.

I have no personal military experience with the M4/16, as we still trained with and inventoried the M14 in our small arms locker shipboard during my tenure. So I was happy to host my coworker at the range a couple times to learn a bit of the USMC M16 manual of arms.
 
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