What exactly is a "truck gun?"

My truck gun is a firearm that I consider secondary to my primary CCW. As mentioned by others, a truck gun is a firearm that is inexpensive but effective. It doesn't always have to be a rifle or long gun; an AR or AK pistol in a bag works just fine.

Since my truck gun is also a "pistol" it can be carried concealed anywhere with my CWL. It fits easily enough in a plain backpack so it can be brought in the house when needed. It is a 10" 7.62x39 AK pistol which packs sufficient power as a rifle, and more ammo as well (I carry 2 extra 30-rd mags with it)

Apachedriver said:

I see what you did there. You conflated two different situations, one of which is aimed at striking at the hearts of readers. A child grabbing a firearm left unsecured is absolutely unlike a reasoning adult grabbing that same firearm for nefarious purposes; Let alone an adult that chooses to break in first.

I don't leave a firearm in my vehicle. I'd hate to return only to face my own weapon, thereby, become forced to take required actions to stop the threat. It's a matter of tactical advantage. Therefore, I don't want others to be put in that circumstance either.

I don't delude myself into believing that I bear any fault in what a criminal chooses to do with a firearm stolen from my vehicle or home. If the firearm is secured out of plain sight under lock and key, then to blame the legal owner for the criminals choices/actions is no different than blaming a rape victim for the choices/actions of the rapist.

I agree we must be smart and responsible in how we secure firearms, but, where is the line drawn to stop blaming the legal owner? Perhaps we should keep our firearms in a local armory? Then we can sign them out during its hours of operation if our homes are not impregnable fortresses. Should we be required to stay and use an onsite range to further reduce the chance of theft? Would gun violence then no longer be the fault of the legal owner? Would gun violence then be stamped out for good?

The criminal makes up his own mind on his actions. Let's put the singular blame where it belongs: the criminal. Let's stop coddling them and start punishing them before we apply rehabilitation.

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Exactly. Sam1911 is perpetuating the myth that crime is somehow the fault of law-abiding citizens who own guns. I hear this nonsense enough from Obama and the media and don't need to hear it on a gun forum.

Law-abiding citizens with guns are part of the solution to crime, not the problem.

Nope. Not even close. It seems to me that you are doing what a lot of folks do -- deliberately NOT looking at nuances and the totality of a situation so you don't have to think harder about a tough issue.

Crime is the FAULT of the criminal. Yes, even if you put your loaded gun on the sidewalk and leave it overnight, if someone steals it it is THEIR fault. If someone kills someone with it it is THEIR fault.

But we all know that we can do things which eliminate or vastly reduce the chances of that happening -- at least with OUR gun because of things WE chose to do.

Facing the fact that our own actions can have an impact on whether our firearms end up stolen and used in crimes scares some gun folks badly. So badly that they won't admit it to be true. Are too afraid to even ask the question of themselves.

I've had the same discussion in the Strategy and Tactics forum over the question of "blaming the victim." Is it some guy's fault that someone jacks him and kills his kid over the fancy bling-bling watch or other property he's been showing around the neighborhood? Of course not! Could he have done things differently and made himself less of a target? Yes. Would he and/or his kid be alive now if he had? Most probably.

Crime IS. Crime will always BE. You can say that it simply isn't your problem, and that's fine. It isn't your fault. Could you do something simple to reduce the chances that you and your guns are involved in it?

Well, I guess that's a scary question.

Count me as one of the many people that view a "truck gun" as a reasonably cheap, reliable long gun (SMLE).

If I lived in an apartment complex then I would not keep a gun in my vehicle 24/7. My truck is in the garage so I'm not worried about leaving guns in there.

One thing I haven't noticed anyone mentioned is diversity. When I see those massive floods across the state in St. Louis, I wonder how many guns (and the ammo that goes with them) are completely submerged in water right now. If you are at work when the floods come, at least you know you'll have access to whatever you have on your person or in your vehicle.

To me, it just makes perfect sense for every vehicle to have a handgun and long gun. Keeping all your guns in one safe could become a problem if a disaster hits. I realize that many people on here have multiple safes. I do not have many guns so I don't need multiple safes.

I'm not worried about zombie hordes or taking out an active shooter, but I like guns and as long as it's legal to keep one in the vehicle then I plan on doing so.

at the ranch my truck gun is a bolt action rifle that I use to take out coyotes, skunks, coons, and "other" predators that might be endangering my livestock and game animals. I currently have a beat up Savage in 25-06 that serves the purpose. I have used it to dispatch injured cattle on occasion.

When I go to Florida I never leave a gun in my unattended truck. I have never had my vehicle broken into but I know of several people in the complex that have. I have an extra pistol in the truck but it goes with me in my computer bag when I go inside an office. I hope I never forget it and try to go through airport security.

At home I often keep a gun in my car, locked up, and I have never had any burglaries in the area. it's "country in the city" if you know what I mean.

I agree. Crime is and always will be.

We can only reduce risk as the absolute removal of risk is impossible. Hence, theft is always a possibility. If a person uses good sense and responsibility in securing their firearm, there is nothing to find regretful if it's stolen. The criminal has availed himself of stolen firearms but the legal owner did not enable the criminal. However, that demands making decisions and taking action to the best of one's ability or circumstances.

What I find unfair is that so many are ready and willing to say, "Of course it's not your fault BUT if you had done _________, then the criminal wouldn't have done ________."

It's a sideswipe of criminal blame on a gun owner that took reasonable actions to safeguard his firearms. By whom? His own peers who leap to accusals and criticisms of his actions as not enough. But...
What action is reasonable enough to absolve the legal owner from the fault of "allowing" his firearms to be stolen?
Is the small grey lockbox the guy in the ghetto can afford enough to be considered reasonable? Or should he not have that firearm then? How about a locked drawer? A car console vault? A trunk vault? An 800 lb RSC? Or should that be in an alarmed safe-room?

If we're to be critiqued or criticized...
What standards are we to apply for a proper security level and location?
Are the nuances of individual circumstances and use of good sense enough? Or are those too vague? Are we to sideswipe each other with blame so we can feel self-justified and morally superior?

By the way, I haven't seen anyone in this thread suggest that they're flashing their firearm around prior to locking it up in any such manner as the bling bling flashers in your latest analogy. So it's apples and oranges again.

Ok. Some of your points I agree with.

This one in particular is fantastic:

We can only reduce risk as the absolute removal of risk is impossible. Hence, theft is always a possibility. If a person uses good sense and responsibility in securing their firearm, there is nothing to find regretful if it's stolen. The criminal has availed himself of stolen firearms but the legal owner did not enable the criminal. However, that demands making decisions and taking action to the best of one's ability or circumstances.

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I'd say it is still regretful that it was stolen, but you took reasonable precautions that it would not be and there are perhaps very limited lessons to be learned from that event.

(There are always lessons to be learned, but how pointed they are and how actionable varies greatly.)

What I find unfair is that so many are ready and willing to say, "Of course it's not your fault BUT if you had done _________, then the criminal wouldn't have done ________."

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It's a fine line, is it not? We cannot ever say that if you had done X, the criminal wouldn't have done Y. None of us can know that. However, we still must be able to learn and incorporate lessons from watching (or experiencing) the negative outcomes of others (or ourselves).

Is there nothing at all to be learned from a police officer who says "I can't count the number of stolen car/truck gun reports I've taken? It happens all the time?" Is there nothing at all to be improved upon in your own habits if you walk out one day and a criminal now possesses the gun you kept tucked away in your car?

"Blame" is an unfortunate term to use. But education, experience, lessons learned -- those are extremely valid concepts and if you stop and think about it, figuring out what we might do better to improve our resistance to forms of criminal predation is the entire reason our S,T,&T forum exists.

We could say, "can't blame the victim for being killed. It was absolutely his right to be in that alley outside that club, unarmed and drunk at 2 am, with that rolex..." That dead guy should NEVER have had to change his plans, avoid drink, or carry a weapon. It isn't right that he should have to. It isn't FAIR. He's got every right to be there and do those things. The criminal is ENTIRELY to blame.

Our hero is still dead. And it is a little beyond our scope to try and determine whether he now feels (or is capable of feeling) righteous or regretful about his choices.

But most of us will do what we DON'T have to do (like carry a gun), and do things that it isn't RIGHT that we must do (like avoid known trouble spots and traveling certain areas late at night), even though that's not FAIR, in order to avoid becoming quite so dead as him, quite so early in life. No?

But we won't be persuaded not to casually leave firearms in unattended vehicles "just because?"

What action is reasonable enough to absolve the legal owner from the fault of "allowing" his firearms to be stolen?

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That's for each person to decide (generally, in most jurisdictions) based on whatever values inform their choices.

Values like that can be influenced by the words and logic of respected peers, of course. We don't make up our minds about how to proceed with almost anything, nor how to place relative values on events and outcomes, in a vacuum. So it is entirely fitting that we share our own values, suggestions, advice, and logic on these matters. Maybe someone who has been very casual about their truck gun storage will decide, "Hey, they've got a point. Maybe I'll get a lock box. Maybe I'll bring it inside for the night. Maybe...whatever." If so, great!

Is the small grey lockbox the guy in the ghetto can afford enough to be considered reasonable?

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Sure! For some circumstances. Results may vary, of course. If someone then steals his car, now they've still stolen his gun, too, and that box won't keep them from selling it or using it. Maybe that box really is the best he can do for some reason. That's up to him to decide.

Or should he not have that firearm then?

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Wow. Those are strong words. I think EVERYONE should be armed, so I'd never say such a thing.

How about a locked drawer? A car console vault? A trunk vault? An 800 lb RSC? Or should that be in an alarmed safe-room?

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Could be, could be, could be, could be, could be... all depends on the situation. Heck, we've got guys who live on a ranch in a farmhouse 2 miles down a dirt road and 10 miles from the nearest other house. Leaving that gun in a peach basket on his front porch is probably "good enough" for him. What are the circumstances? What is the risk? How do you balance the costs vs. benefits among all the options you could choose for "going armed?"

Are we to sideswipe each other with blame so we can feel self-justified and morally superior?

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Please do not do that. It won't be taken well.

By the way, I haven't seen anyone in this thread suggest that they're flashing their firearm around prior to locking it up in any such manner as the bling bling flashers in your latest analogy. So it's apples and oranges again.

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An analogy doesn't seek to show you two things that are identical. They are examples of similar enough situations or juxtapositions of concepts that they can bridge a communication gap.

Sometimes.

We know that motor vehicles are very, very often THE FOCUS of petty criminal predation. Moreso than almost any other place or thing or situation. You don't have to "flash around" anything to tell a criminal that there's probably something of interest in a car or truck. He already knows he's got a real good chance of scoring something valuable out of a car. I'd rather his "score" wasn't a lethal weapon. My feelings are that since that is the case, storing a firearm in one as a matter of course is a very problematic and vulnerable choice, which should be taken only when the reasons for doing so are realistic, present, and compelling. Many people disagree and feel there is no "blame," or "fault" or "lessons to be learned" here and that the most casual attitude towards leaving guns in cars or trucks is perfectly reasonable. After all, it isn't their fault the criminal smashed a window and grabbed it. So they have nothing at all they could learn. Hmmm. Well, that's their choice. One might certainly reasonably wonder how many guns they might have to have stolen out of their car before they decide to quit leaving them in there.

jrdolall said:

at the ranch my truck gun is a bolt action rifle that I use to take out coyotes, skunks, coons, and "other" predators that might be endangering my livestock and game animals. I currently have a beat up Savage in 25-06 that serves the purpose. I have used it to dispatch injured cattle on occasion.

When I go to Florida I never leave a gun in my unattended truck. I have never had my vehicle broken into but I know of several people in the complex that have. I have an extra pistol in the truck but it goes with me in my computer bag when I go inside an office. I hope I never forget it and try to go through airport security.

At home I often keep a gun in my car, locked up, and I have never had any burglaries in the area. it's "country in the city" if you know what I mean.

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If you want to get into definitions- our "truck gun" is an ancient 30-30 lever action made by a company called Glenfield that either Dad or my uncle bought sometime before I was born. Off duty it resides in the "office" of the machine shed leaning against the corner. It is only transported in the "farm truck" which is a possibly more ancient Chevrolet 3/4 ton pickup. The farm truck's only purpose is as a vehicle to solve problems and is for all intents and purposes a rolling shop. The use of the rifle is for pests and the occasion cow that is injured or has a stuck calf.

On the average said truck is taken off farm maybe six times a year and every year I argue (unsuccessfully to date) of it even being licensed. The reasons being the driver is invariably pulled over. Not for the rifle in the back window but since it only has lap belts LEO's instantly assume they have a seat belt violation.

Considering my brother's sense of humor if the LEO had any sense of duty he would be far more concern with the portable welder and cutting torch as either tool makes the man an insult to the peace and dignity of a civilized society.

As we muddle along through this thread defining a "truck gun" and drifting on and off topic I happen to notice this thread.

It only takes a minute to have a few rifles stolen. They weren't even truck guns. As sad as it is anymore when I go to and from the range I really avoid any stops at all cost. On the way a stop at the Burger King drive through, I won't park and go in. When I leave the range I drive straight home and if I have errands I unload my guns and then run any errands. Years ago thought nothing of leaving a gun in the truck but not today, not in my location anyway. Yeah, pretty damn sad.

Ron

In my mind, a truck gun is a beater rifle carried by people in rural areas who actually stand a fair chance of using it.
As far as carrying one myself...during hunting season, certainly. But that gun almost always leaves my vehicle when I do, and I make sure to minimize any stops during which I'd have to leave it unattended in the vehicle. It never gets left in the vehicle overnight.
I don't view them as an ideal self defense tool to be stored in a vehicle, as the instances of guns being stolen from vehicles far outweighs instances where a rifle accessed from storage in a vehicle has/would have saved someones life where a ccw would not.

I drive a convertible most of the time, so I don't leave anything in it that would tempt someone with 30 seconds to spare and a sharp rock.

Good Grief!
Know of at least one liberal "authority" figure that wanted to hold owners responsible for letting their cars warm up unattended when they're stolen.

I do know that leaving your vehicle running unattended is now illegal in numerous areas.

As much as I hate it, that is the current state of our country.

matrem said:

Good Grief!
Know of at least one liberal "authority" figure that wanted to hold owners responsible for letting their cars warm up unattended when they're stolen.

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Only a small stretch from liberals who want to hold gun manufacturers responsible when their products are misused. Why not sue Ford when a driver has an accident?

From link to thread in post #110

Marlin model 444S (presafety) in 444 Marlin with Nitrex 1.5-5 scope, serial# XXXXXXX
Savage 110 in 30-06 with Bushnell Ultra HD 3-9x40 scope, serial# XXXXXXXX

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Just don't see a lot of reports in my area of crimes and/or shootings conducted with lever or bolt-action rifles. Just sayin' ...

Most likely, that type of gun is going to be attempted to be dealt at a local pawn shop, not carried by a criminal for use in a robbery, murder or rape.

silicosys4 said:

In my mind, a truck gun is a beater rifle carried by people in rural areas who actually stand a fair chance of using it.

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Mainly, yes. Even though I often have an old AK folder and a few mags in the trunk (secured by a combination lock so no smash & grab theft risk) I don't take it with me when I go shopping downtown or if I have to leave my car parked overnight in an unknown public location.

Truck gun? I always think of a surplus military bolt action like an Enfield Jungle Carbine that didn't cost much, is slightly dinged up, but will put several rounds in a 3" circle at 100 yards. A good AKM (before someone decided those were $850 guns) also comes to mind.

J1

Any gun mounted on wheels which you need a truck to tow.

same poster makes these two statements in one post...

My guns are insured, in or out of the house, so if it is stolen I'll just replace it.

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The evil people have no problem getting a gun no matter what I do.

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It's truly sad how many people don't see the connection between #1 and #2.

We as 2A types can't have it both ways. We rail against UBCs, etc., because "criminals obtain their firearms by illegal means", and then we facilitate that supply chain and rationalize our irresponsible storage methods.

Don't get me wrong--I am not a proponent of UBCs. But I also don't leave a firearm in my vehicle unattended. Have a gun in your truck while you're out? Okay. When you get home, take it inside. If you stop somewhere and have to leave the vehicle, lock the weapon to something solid.

taliv said:

i sleep pretty well at night. but my house has a garage. I don't sweat vehicle theft though. and I have a lot more valuables than a gun in there. heck my ham radio's worth more than the rifle. and then there's the night vision, plate carrier, cash, etc.

maybe the lawyers are worse now, but I don't think crime is worse now than in the 70s and 80s when people left their doors unlocked. sure, people's perceptions have changed a lot. was it child abuse for my parents to let me walk a mile to school in kindergarden in suburban sacramento? i don't think so. I think people have lost their minds today. Do the facts really warrant it? not to me. so what is it that REALLY changed to make people think a shotgun in the back window of a truck is totally inappropriate today? as far as i'm concerned, the only legit reason not to is because the rear windows are electric and slide open.

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Look at FBI statistics - crime in the USA in 1980 was one hell of a lot worse than it is now in almost every category they track. 1980-1981 was the peak in overall violent crime and there has been a downward trend ever since. Homicide peaked in 1991 and has dropped radically since then. The media spends a lot more time covering it so people think it has gotten worse because they hear about it constantly but the exact opposite is true. Overall, violent crimes including homicide, rape, aggravated assault, and robbery dropped 38% between 1992 and 2011 and that trend has continued through at least 2014 which is the most recent year with published statistics.

"Any gun mounted on wheels which you need a truck to tow."

Well not quite. I have 1 ea: Truck, 1/4ton, M38A1 (commonly called a Jeep). On this "truck" I have a military issue "mount, MG" (commonly called a "gun post"). On that mount I have an MG 42. THAT IS A TRUCK GUN!
Sarge

OK if we are bending towards silly................

Just before Y2K a friend that lives off the end of a dirt road in the woods ask me for advice on a rifle that would "Stop a pick up down at the curve" about 450 yards away. Such a rifle would be a "truck gun"

-kBob

Truck gun: a gun you can only haul around in the bed of a truck.
E.g. A Vulcan cannon is a truck gun.
Or would that be a truck bed gun?
Maybe an Anzio 20mm bolt action. (While I have no use for it, I want one).

When people say "truck gun", I still get an instant mental picture of a Jungle Carbine, an SKS or an AKM circa 1989 for some reason...even though I cannot remember anyone having any of the above in a truck. The ones I actually remember seeing in trucks on a regular basis were Winchester or Marlin 30-30 lever actions or some variety of 30-06 bolt action. Possibly an 870 12 gauge. Gun magazines must have subliminally programmed me to think of the Enfield, SKS and AKM.

MDI_Weapon said:

Truck gun: a gun you can only haul around in the bed of a truck.
E.g. A Vulcan cannon is a truck gun.
Or would that be a truck bed gun?
Maybe an Anzio 20mm bolt action. (While I have no use for it, I want one).

When people say "truck gun", I still get an instant mental picture of a Jungle Carbine, an SKS or an AKM circa 1989 for some reason...even though I cannot remember anyone having any of the above in a truck. The ones I actually remember seeing in trucks on a regular basis were Winchester or Marlin 30-30 lever actions or some variety of 30-06 bolt action. Possibly an 870 12 gauge. Gun magazines must have subliminally programmed me to think of the Enfield, SKS and AKM.

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If you are going to get free with your fancy... A Rhodesian gentleman (Ian Smith may have surrendered but he never did) told me of a device called a spider that consisted of 16 12 guage shotgun barrels arranged in a circle mounted to the top of the cab of a vehicle. To fire the weapon a crank was inserted into the central hub and turned firing each barrel in turn. Since the Spider would be part of the truck it would be in essence a "truck gun."

I would question it's usefulness against coyotes though.

But if I spot a blonde grizzy on the hillside while fishing, I can go and get my "truck gun."

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I did similar when I was up in AK, but it was in the boat, not the truck (as we didn't have enough roads to drive anywhere but town).

Though I generally figured the tactic when dealing with a wandering grizz was to just leave (boat or truck).


My only truck gun is my CCW when I (sadly) have to leave it in my vehicle during work hours. I still am concerned with theft, though it is secured in a locked compartment in a locked vehicle in a relatively busy parking lot.

I personally can't think on a reason to keep a long gun in my truck unless I'm heading to the range or hunting after work.