1911 cocked and locked Without holster

[1911Tuner]

I have also slipped a cocked 1911 in my belt when there was a hint that I very well may need it RIGHT NOW !!!

If I get a hint that I'll need a gun like right now...and I have the option...I'm not going to pick up a sidearm of any description.

Neither have I, in my almost 50 years of doing it on occasion..

Me either.

go for a 50 yd flat out run with your holsterless gun in your pants and tell us at what yard marker the gun falls out at.

Too old to run. I carry a gun so I won't have to.

I guess I can be on the short list of idiots that goes holsterless. It really does cut down on the bulk, and makes the gun more hideable...but I don't indulge in flat-out sprints or gymnastics any more..and I find myself going for waistband carry more often than not these days, and I've never had a problem since I stopped sprinting and doing somersaults while carrying. In fact...There's a 3-inch Model 13 tucked comfortably and securely in the front of my waistband this very minute. It's been there since 0500 and I've scarcely noticed it.

For those who want to explore the possibilities...try a Poor Man's IWB rig. A length of shoestring tied between two belt loops, with enough slack for the top of the string to reach about a hlaf-inch above the belt. Slip the gun through and into the waistband. It rides nicely whether carried conventionally, or...with the 1911...butt-forward for added concealability...(It doesn't print as badly when bending or stooping.)...and it's only a tick slower from the "leather" than when carried the other way. It also allows the pistol to be canted for even further reduced print stooping. This particular method works very well in T-shirt weather, incidentally.

 

[Hoxviii]

Only grumble I have with the above is

Take the gun in the good/free hand, and jam the bottom the slide against some thing hard nearby (barricade, curb, heel of shoe, belt)

Definitely works, but everytime i've tried to practice it (or frequently enough that i'm not going to rely on it), the barrel hits the hard surface as well, stopping me dead. Also a no-go with a solid FLGR.

or...with the 1911...butt-forward for added concealability...(It doesn't print as badly when bending or stooping.)

Wow, just wow. I read this and tried it and holy cow does it work well . That's always been my issue, the point on the end of the grip of a 1911. Like this it just completely follows the countour of my body, draw really isn't even that odd, either.

This here gets a big ol' hardy thumbs up

 

[Frank Ettin]

... there are scores of people who will criticize me, but I carry some 1911's and some other SA autos chamber empty...

I'm one, and I probably have. Of course, how you carry is up to you. I sure don't teach condition 3. But this is off topic and has been dealt with at length elsewhere.

One thing occurs to me however. There you are out in the world and you think you're about to be attacked. So you draw your gun and chamber a round and the guy beats feet in the opposite direction. So there you are standing there holding a gun that has round in the chamber. What do you do? Clear your roscoe standing out on the street corner?

Anyway, I'll take condition 1. I've occasionally used Mexican carry when going out to the garage late at night for something, but I wouldn't use it for extended periods of time out in public.

 

[phrogmech]

I find it is up to the user, if he or she wants to use a holster or not, personal preference. My preference is one in the tube safety on. In a holster.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

"One thing occurs to me however. There you are out in the world and you think you're about to be attacked. So you draw your gun and chamber a round and the guy beats feet in the opposite direction. So there you are standing there holding a gun that has round in the chamber. What do you do? Clear your roscoe standing out on the street corner?"
Why not? If the corner was good enough to get attacked, it's good enough for post-gun handling. You could always put it on safe, stick it in you waistband until you find a discreet place to handle the gun to unload it, go back to Condition 3, etc.

 

[pbearperry]

Sticking a gun in your waistband and going out in public is a recipe for disaster.Put it in a holster,fanny pack or pants pocket.

 

[1911Tuner]

Sticking a gun in your waistband and going out in public is a recipe for disaster

Hmmm...

Guess my time is overdue...since I've done that a lot over the last 35+ years that I've carried a gun on a daily basis.

'Course, I'm not one of those tactical, high-speed/low-drag types, either...which may account in some part for the lack of disasters that have befallen me.

You could always put it on safe, stick it in you waistband until you find a discreet place to handle the gun to unload it, go back to Condition 3, etc.

Why bother with clearing the gun? It's as safe in C-1 in the waistband as it is in an open-topped holster...assuming that the thumb and grip safeties are operating properly.

I find it is up to the user, if he or she wants to use a holster or not, personal preference.

And right there is the bottom line.

 

[EddieNFL]

I guess I can be on the short list of idiots that goes holsterless.

There are a bunch of us.

Some folks have trouble using a crosscut saw; that's why we have carpenters.

 

[mcdonl]

1911 Turner... for the record... you do not strike me as amateur or the would-be gangsta type.

I have on occasion carried a SA/DA pistol in that manner, but I have what seems to be overly corrosive sweat and it is bad for the gun. For this reason I have stopped IWB and have gone to OWB...

 

[earlthegoat2]

I think the moral of the story it that not too many of us here regularly carry a 1911 C&Led without a holster. Many of us do it occasionally. None of us have had problems doing it occasionally.

Sometimes what is preached to us as being right is not always right every time.

 

[Deanimator]

Plaxico Burress has nothing to do with the OP's question.

He shot himself with a Safe-Action Glock, by pulling the trigger.
Had it been a Cocked & Locked 1911, nothing would have happened.

So you don't mind if it falls out on the ground so long as it doesn't go off?

 

[David E]

I believe someone mentioned grabbing a gun in a hurry.

To check out a funny noise, sure. My comments have been about routinely carrying a gun holsterless.

Also, it's cheaper.

As I noted. Of course, this presumes that the cost only will be money.....

The gun sits a little lower

Which compromises a full firing grip.

and no added bulk from a holster.

Which is why I've emphasized a good holster. A good rig adds little, if any, discernible bulk.

Being able to obtain a full firing grip upon first contact with the gun is important to me. (as it is to many other well known instructors) Carrying a gun stuffed into your pants typically won't consistently allow a full firing grip throughout the day.

A consistent firing grip is the first step to getting a fast, first shot on target.

I'd be curious to see the "stuff it in your pants" folks compare their draw/first shot/first hit times between holstered and holsterless.

 

[EddieNFL]

My experiences are no more wrong than your opinions. You gave permission to carry without a holster so I'll return the favor: You're welcome to carry in a holster.

It works for me and many, many others over the years. I'm weary of the semantics and what ifs so I'm out.

I'd be curious to see the "stuff it in your pants" folks compare their draw/first shot/first hit times between holstered and holsterless.

Yes, I have. Slightly slower than with IWB holster. OWB holster is faster still, so I guess, using your logic, IWBs are a bad idea.

P.S. How much was our bet?

 

[David E]

Yes, I have. Slightly slower than with IWB holster. OWB holster is faster still, so I guess, using your logic, IWBs are a bad idea.

What is "slightly slower" to you? One second? Two?

From my own experience, using a full size 1911 Govt in a KyTac IWB from concealment, my best draw/first shot was .74 Fast enough for me.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

If all this cocked and locked stuff bothers one, then a 1911 with Series 80 safety features (I think Kimbers have a different style, but equally effective, firing pin safety) could be used. I used to own a Series 80 Colt, and the gun cannot fire even if thumb safety is off, gun falls hard and lets the hammer slam on the firing pin, UNLESS someone has their finger on the trigger, too. The trigger HAS to be engaged to clear the fring pin drop. Eliminates the dropped/accidental discharge. I just don't care for the extra moving parts, which HAVE malfunctioned once on my Series 80. One concerned more with safety than me might like the FP block concept.

 

[Oro]

If all this cocked and locked stuff bothers one,

Then learn to carry condition 2. Solves so many problems and concerns, both real and imagined.

 

[rcmodel]

So you don't mind if it falls out on the ground so long as it doesn't go off?

Sir, I have dropped a C&L'ed 1911 exactly once in about 50 years of carrying them in every kind of holster, and Mexican carry without a holster.

The one time I dropped one, I dropped it real good.
I threw it downrange about 10 yards to be exact.

That was due to a fumbled draw from a Jeff Cooper inspired steel-lined speed holster.

Had I been drawing from a Mexican carry, I would have had a better grip on it before it cleared my pants I betcha.

rc

 

[David E]

I wonder how many classes or instructors or matches allow their students/competitors to go holsterless........

Fumbling the draw from a holster wasn't the holster's fault..............

 

[dmazur]

I "cured" myself of the Mexican carry habit by leaving the holster on my belt. If I need to leave the house, I grab the 1911 and stuff it in the holster, which is always on my belt. It's a Galco Quick Slide, so it doesn't have much bulk and it doesn't really look like a holster when it's empty.

(Kind of like the folks who referenced the "Beltster"...always available.)

 

[EddieNFL]

From my own experience, using a full size 1911 Govt in a KyTac IWB from concealment, my best draw/first shot was .74 Fast enough for me.

Impressive. Faster than Ron Leatham from a duty holster (not IWB or concealed).

 

[Avenger29]

I "cured" myself of the Mexican carry habit by leaving the holster on my belt. If I need to leave the house, I grab the 1911 and stuff it in the holster, which is always on my belt. It's a Galco Quick Slide, so it doesn't have much bulk and it doesn't really look like a holster when it's empty.

There are also various paddle holsters for quick on/off. I don't like paddle holsters for day to day carry, but I do like being able to quickly don one along with a jacket or 5.11 vest for a run down to the store...

 

[ny32182]

I never would, and can hardly believe we have people on a gun forum advocating it as a good idea.

If I grab a gun in the middle of the night and think I might NEED IT NOW, it won't be in a holster, or waistband, or any place other than in my hand.

Any other time, I have the 10 seconds it takes to put the IWB on my belt.

The only exception I've ever made is if I wanted to get a pistol from my glovebox to the interior of my residence without anyone seeing it, and even then it would do more shifting than I would find acceptable in a whole day of carrying with a holster.

 

[David E]

Impressive. Faster than Ron Leatham from a duty holster (not IWB or concealed).

I've never seen Robbie draw from a duty rig. If and when he does, I doubt he has too many reps with it, since he is not a cop.

I've beaten Rob before on stages, both in time and points, but the man just won't quit and he hardly ever screws anything up too bad..... At a recent Single Stack Classic, I was winning a stage, but he screwed up the stage before that one and "got mad" and kicked ass on "my" stage.........well, being second to Robbie is still doing pretty good in my book.

 

[EddieNFL]

I doubt he has too many reps with it, since he is not a cop.

Apparently, more than a few as the time reported was quite fast.

Let's each take our doubts and move on. Out.

 

[David E]

Apparently, more than a few as the time reported was quite fast.

No doubt. He IS Robbie, after all.