Anybody actually conceal a black powder revolver/firearm?

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Well, I found the chart pretty darn interesting. I am also familiar with Sanows work. Strawhat yer 1860 is SHAMOAKIN! I think against the guy with the Glock you might make out, while he's ponderin the IRON(y), plunk him.

After TSHTF some guys are going to be flippin out over ammo shortages,
others are going to be saving urine in little jars, grinding up briquettes, melting wheel weights off of cars, and rollin their own.

One other thing, as to this vastly superior fire power, I have seen quite a few deer shot all with modern cartridges, and some bows. To this day the ONLY deer that displayed what I would call that mythical knockdown, was shot with a 50 Cal round ball. I mean thumped and down about 3 feet to the side of his tracks!
 
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Never said the C&B wheelgun ain't a killer. Worked three shootings in my 25 years as a cop that involved C&B pistols. One homeowner shot an armed intruder twice in the chest with an 1860 Colt Army. The two round balls tore the badguy up and he was lying in a pile in the living room where he was plugged. The homeowner said he would have done a follow up shot to the head, but a busted cap got jambed in the hammer/frame area....

The other two were not as cool (if one can say that about people getting shot) but a .36 Navy was involved and the badguy lived, but he had a deflated lung and some internal bleeding that made him stop what he was doing to get himself shot. I'm quite sure that if our shooter fired another into this guy he would never had made it to the table in ER.

The third was just "a flesh wound" as they say. The badguy was hit in the upper arm near the shoulderblade with a lightly loaded .44 Remmy. The shooter said his Remmy was loaded for target work and thus it was not up to doing some real damage. The badguy, however, ran from the garage where he was trying to enter the home, and was found bleeding like a stuck pig a few blocks away in an ally. He was not a happy fellon!

Did work another involving an "accidental", later proved "intentional" shooting with a .50 cal Hawken. The victim was a real mess and I'm not going to go into details. But the shooter later confessed to wanting to shoot his drinking buddy as he found that his bud was having a fling with the other's wife....He got 20 years....

So, again, I'm not saying that a C&B cannot get the job done. I'm just saying that if it's all you got, then you are not helpless. Just a might behind the times gun wise I suppose...

Ok, off my little soapbox now....

Have fun, be safe, and by all means, use your head!

Wade
 
Holy cow there Ranger; I didn't think anyone on this forum would be able to cite any incidents where black powder weapons were used to inflict harm on people, and yet you've mentioned three such examples!

I agree with you; if it's all you got, well ok. But there are much, much better options available these days.

Jason
 
As with all firearms of any kind, concealed carrying a loaded BP pistol requires a CCW permit. First and Foremost.

As for the peoples concerns regaurding accuracy, reliability, and the stopping power of a BP Concealed weapon... Alow me to assure those gentlemen, nearly all self defense situations, requiring a person to expose or fire a weapon, occur in very close quarters, 10 feet or less, with only two or three people involved. If you can't hit your target with a BP revolver at 10 feet, you better hang up the gun entirely !!!

And as far as firepower is concerned... Once I fire my 44 Caliber Remingtion New Army Sheriffs Model (5-1/2" barrel, 6 shot) at some thugs forehead, packing the equivalent of a magnum load and magnum conical... beleive me, their brains are vacated out the back of their heads, and, they are dead before they hit the ground.

Need I remind these gentleman, that the civil war, the bloodiest war this country has ever fought, was entirely fought with BP weapons, most of which were ML's, claiming at or about 660,000 soldiers lives.

If 6 shots isn't enough for you, then, carry pre-loaded spare cylinders with you, I do this myself, I keep them in nice small little leather pouches, in my coat pocket, with the gun hanging down in an old fashioned Wild Bill style under the arm over the shoulder holster.

Sincerely,

ElvinWarrior... aka... David, "EW"

PocketPlating001.jpg
 
Need I remind these gentleman, that the civil war, the bloodiest war this country has ever fought, was entirely fought with BP weapons

Yes, but we're no longer limited to Civil War technology. There are much better weapons these days. For instance, with the new fangled smokeless powder technology, you don't have to worry about a percussion cap jamming the works.
 
Holy cow there Ranger; I didn't think anyone on this forum would be able to cite any incidents where black powder weapons were used to inflict harm on people, and yet you've mentioned three such examples!

Somewhere around here (SE PA) within the past 15 years a person was murdered with a Ruger Old Army.

I agree with you; if it's all you got, well ok. But there are much, much better options available these days.

Agreed. Percussion revolvers are deadly weapons. But small arms technology advanced quite a bit even in the late 19th Century. Why intentionally handicap yourself?
 
I'd say carrying a cap and ball revolver concealed for self defense is probably more of a romantic notion.

These were excellent self defense weapons when everyone else was carrying the same thing.
 
busyhands 94- it is not a very safe practice to pull bullets from a rimfire case- you might set off the ammo
 
BP Revolvers For Defence

I don't know anything about the .31 cal, cause I've never fired one, I would like a baby dragoon one of these days. Ordered the molds for the .36 cal 130gr, and .44 cal 200gr bullets, and started molding round ball, and bullets for the revolver's with the help from some of you folks. Ranger you talked about the rd ball hitting the bad guy, would you care to take a guess at what he would look like after being hit with two of these bullets. They are with out a doubt a hole new ball game in punch. I tried the .44 bullets in my Walker with just 40grs, and I thought rd ball was something, these bullets punch big holes. They also fit both of my 58 New Army revolver's, and both of my 1860s. Most don't like them because they say there not as accurate as rd ball, I still have some shooting to do for I can say for sure. From what I've shot so far there not to bad at 30 feet. Haven't tried the .36 cal bullets yet. The 5.5" barrel 58 is my choice to carry if I wanted to take a walk, or keep loaded for defense in my home. I am sure this bullet, and 25grs of black powder would stop a person. The revolver's I have are not hard to load with these bullets. I will say they kick more than rd ball. Sence the Walker is so big, and new to me. I don't think it would be a good idea, at least not just yet. But I can't help but think what the bad guy would do if you cut loose with this thing on him, talk about him being on fire LOL :evil: I'll keep my 1911 around, over the years I've come to trust it for self defense. I don't know anyone that would rule out these autos for the next fifty years. If I didn't have it, I would fill safe with black powder revolver's, round ball, or bullet. Like you all know most shootings in homes, or anywhere else, most often happen in feet, not yards. I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. Like others have said, pick out the ONE you want, and shoot it often, You'll be just fine. Hope to never have to find out. :)
 
Gentlemen,

Yes it is true, that the "newfangled smokeless guns" have advanced greatly in recent years. However, gentlemen, in an actual street gun battle involving you, and one or more thugs, it isn't your gun or their gun, that is going to determine the outcome, it is the mindset, training, and skill of the persons involved. The gun is nothing but a tool, it is the person holding the gun, that makes all the differance.

For example, lets say I am out at about 10:00 PM, walking my dog late at night, down at the local city park about 2 blocks from where I live. Out of the shadows of the trees, I see a person comming towards me at a brisk pace. Being older, and having been mugged before, I immeadiately reach under my coat, pull my 44 Remington half out of the shoulder harness and cock it, keeping it under my coat, but ready. I also, know from experiance, that the smarter thugs out there, never work alone, I take a quick look around, and sure enough, comming up on my behind is a second guy. I now, back off rapidly, perhaps even behind a tree, so that I am no longer exposed from front and back at the same time. Now, it has been my experiance, and I am an older guy with more than a little experiance in situations of this nature, that these career criminal thug types, who actually attempt to prey upon persons in situations of this nature, are not the brightest boys on the block, generally, they are rather stupid, they have a set plan in place, and do things the same way, every time. They aren't very good at thinking on their feet, adapting to changing situations that surprise them by confronting them with responses they did not anticipate....

Do you see what I am getting at? It's more of a game of guts, willpower, and skill, than it is a simple matter of who has the newest prettiest gun. The man holding the gun is worth ten of them if he is skilled, no matter how he is armed.

This is MY POINT, the gun, actual model of gun, as long as it is large enough and powerful enough to take down and stop a man in one shot, is actually, rather irrelevant, especially when you are dealing with criminal types of mentality, who rarely spend the time, or the effort, to perfect their skills, as dedicated sportsmen, such as ourselves do.

My mom had a saying, she liked to quote to me, especially at times like Christmas and my birthdays, when I wanted some expensive, overpriced present, and what she got me, was something ENTIRELY DIFFERENT, but modestly priced, something she could afford to give to me... What she often said to me was this... "David, a concert pianist can play an old beat up out of tune honky-tonk piano, and make it sound like a brand new concert Grand !!!

It's not about the shiney expensive piano guys, it's about the skill of the pianist !!!

As far as the comments regaurding small calibers not being able to have any significant knock down power at all... When you guys have time the next time your out pliknking, or at the range, try this little trick....

Take your small caliber conical, say, a 31 or 22 conical, and with your handy-dandy large size exacto knife, score the conical with the razor, about 1/4 of the the way through the conical, in 4 sections, leaving some lead, in the center of the conical, so that the conical will not disentigrate in the barrel. When the scored conical hits it's target, it will fragment into many, many pieces, much more than just 4, it nearly EXPLODES on impact. To prove this to yourself, bring a few oranges with you, nice firm solid ones, fire a few unscored solids at the oranges... It will make a mess of the oranges, but, mostly they hold together rather well... Now, set up some fresh oranges, and fire at them with the scored bullets... You will be AMAZED at the differance... The oranges will be entirely pulverized, they will litterally EXPLODE from the fragmentation of the conicals. All you will find of them is orange pulp, and small fragments of orange peel scattered everywhere.

Like I said gentleman, it's all about knowledge and skill.

In closing, allow me to relay to you another example, of skill, versus, fancy-schmancy hardware. When I was about 15, my Dad, who was a fishing enthusiast, and always spent way too much money on way overpriced rigs, took me out river fishing on the Chagrin River, which is a tributary to the Ohio River, in Ohio. Great fishing on that river, if you KNOW how to fish. We were there nearly a half day, with only a few nibbles to our name, and a handful of rather pathetic smaller fish, despite the fact that my Dad had just spent nearly a thousand bucks on all kinds of fancy fishing crapola. Along comes this family of a father, and 3 boys, they were wearing nothing more than gym shorts, t-shirts, and sneakers with no sox, they each had a fishing basket hangind down from around their necks, and almost no fishing tackel at all... They were fishing, with bare line and hooks, and live worm bait, no reels, no rod, no fancy lures or scents or anything fancy at all, just line, held in their bare hands... They were wading, in the river, waist deep, all of them, feeding out their lines... About 10 yards down stream of where we were, commisserating on our lousy "luck", they began to pull out large, flapping fish, ALL OF THEM, one, after the other, after the other... It was the most AMAZING demonstration of fishing skill I have ever seen in my life... In less than 10 minutes, this father, and his three young sons, aged about 8 to 12, pulled out about 15 fish, all of them two to three times as large as what me and my dad had caught, the entire morning !!!

Think about that one guys... THINK !!!

Sincerely,

ElvinWarrior... aka... David, "EW"
 
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EW;
I've said that more than once on here & other places, let me also add that in most shooting scenerios there is less than 6 shots fired total so the capacity of the firearm is not the deciding factor in a shooting but the proficiency of the shooter with their chosen weapon.
 
Voodoo,

What can I say? Perhaps it boils down to nothing more than having been around two or three times longer than some of these pups out there....

LOL !!!

ElvinWarrior... aka... David, "EW"
 
EW;
I've thankfully been in one shooting that involved me firing a weapon & hope to live the rest of my life with that track record.

I cary my C&B Revolvers open because where I take em there is no need for concealment but like you & some others here I know my weapons & myself enough that if it occured that I needed it to defend myself against 4 or 2 legged creatures with one I know I have the same chances as they do of success possibly better depending on their determination & proficiency.
 
EW I live right on the Chagrin River.
Let me tell you I have never caught a single fish in my life here.
I must not be a good river fisherman, take me to a lake and I will run out of bait :neener:
 
Well, now, the .31 isn't all THAT impressive, pushing a 60 grain conical to 900 fps with a full charge of 777. Pyrodex pushing it along a tad over 700 fps which gives .22LR energies. It's a little bigger bullet, of course, and pointy, should penetrate okay. Bullet comes from the mold seen in this picture.

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All in all, I'd rather carry my 9 or my .38, though. More power, more reliable, more convenient.
 
Quoting 45-70 Ranger:

"The homeowner said he would have done a follow up shot to the head, but a busted cap got jambed in the hammer/frame area...."

...and therein lies the problem. If bad things are gonna happen, chances are they'll happen at the worst possible time. And yes, a semi-auto could've jammed at the same time.

I know percussions can be reliable. I fired 120 rounds out of mine at End of Trail with no misfires or capjams. But my life wasn't on the line at End of Trail.

Now, all that said, I still sometimes grab my '51 and throw it in the pickup with me when I'm going somewhere.
 
MC Gunner I wouldn't want to load a full charge of 777 or Pyrodex into any brass framed gun.:neener:
They do make an all steel version of the Remington pocket, I remember one video in which the shooter actually loaded his with a cast .32 S&W-Long wadcutter ontop a full charge off powder.
What is the max charge for one of those .31 chambers?
 
That's right, guys, keep telling yourselves that a romantic affectation is some sort of rational choice. Why not strap on a rapier and a big hat with a feather in it, too? Heck, get yourself a cape and use it to distract your assailant while you're at it.
 
That's right, guys, keep telling yourselves that a romantic affectation is some sort of rational choice. Why not strap on a rapier and a big hat with a feather in it, too? Heck, get yourself a cape and use it to distract your assailant while you're at it.
Those ideas would work too.
 
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Yep ~ I see The High Road here. Bashing others because they have a different opinion always carries the day.

I'm just glad to see others interested in guns and shooting.

On a personal note, I'm not standing in front of any gun to prove its lack of effectiveness. Not gonna voluntarily be stabbed with a rapier either.
 
Joe your post has me laughing awfully good right now :D
Nothing like a good bashing to wake a thread up.

Just to beat a dead horse, has anybody tried loading LHP's into a cap n' ball revolver and tested for expansion? :rolleyes:
 
Play nice or the thread gets locked.

A muzzle loader rifle or a cap 'n ball gun will kill as sure as it did in its heyday during the Civil War. That said, it would still not be my first choice of weapon.
 
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