Best all around versatile powder for 9mm

[thomas15]

After all this discussion I may switch from TG to PP.

Feel free by all means to experiment but for 9mm handloads, TG and PP represent the polar opposites, the A/Z, the beginning and the end of the useable powders for that caliber. One is at the fast end of the scale, the other is at the slow end of the scale.

It is true of course that any handloader can get either to go bang. And it is true that depending on the application, either powder could be perfect. It really comes down to what the handloader is trying to accomplish.

 

[LiveLife]

There was a time when Unique didn't exist and after it was introduced it created a following which still exist today. (No, I did not like Unique because it did not meter well with .3 to .5 gr jumps and accuracy was not good compared to other powders)

There was a time when Bullseye didn't exist and after it was introduced, it created a following which still exist today. (Yes, I like Bullseye, especially for 9mm)

There was a time when W231/HP-38 didn't exist and after their introduction, they created a following which still exist today. (Yes, I like W231/HP-38, especially for 380Auto/9mm/40S&W/45ACP)

There was a time when N320 didn't exist and after it was introduced, it created a following which still exist today. (Yes, I liked N320 but not the price tag)

There was a time when Titegroup didn't exist and after it was introduced, it created a following which still exist today. (Yes, I like Titegroup, especially for 9mm)

There was a time when BE-86 didn't exist and after it was introduced, it created a following that is growing today. (Yes, I like BE-86, especially for 40S&W)

There was a time when Sport Pistol didn't exist and after it was introduced, it created a following that is growing today. (Yes, I like Sport Pistol especially for 380Auto/9mm/40S&W/45ACP)

There was a time when IMR Target didn't exist and after it was introduced, it created a following that is growing today. (Yes, I like Target, especially for 9mm)

And so on ...

And I like supporting powder manufacturers who produce powders in the USA - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...g-components-made.577067/page-4#post-10297475

 

[thomas15]

If I may add, there was also a time, for well over a year, that the greatest thing since sliced bread, when BE-86 as a canister product, existed only on paper, in catalogs, in advertisements in Handloader magazine, load manuals and in the dreams of handloaders but not in any of our retailers inventory. There was an approx. 1 year period where some posters, even here on this board, speculated on the release date and the what the graphics on the container would look like and for that matter what shape the container would be.

 

[RikSors]

Unique

Cast, plated, fmj, good to go...

 

[LiveLife]

when BE-86 as a canister product, existed only on paper, in catalogs, in advertisements in Handloader magazine, load manuals and in the dreams of handloaders but not in any of our retailers inventory

That's why we came up with "Where is reloading components for sale" thread during the "Great Component Shortage" so we could alert members which vendors had popular components in stock.

If you have been around Handloading & Reloading category since early 2013, you should have known our thread blew gunbot and other search bots in the dust as they lagged (Often hours to days during which time items were sold out. It was a time when early bird got the worm as items were sold first come, first served.) and didn't list many vendors we bought from who sold at lower prices than many other vendors not listed on our list - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ponents-on-sale.707473/page-167#post-10933821

BTW, here are threads that alerted "in stock" of BE-86 during the "Great Shortage":

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...omponents-on-sale.707473/page-97#post-9632992

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...mponents-on-sale.707473/page-103#post-9678297

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...mponents-on-sale.707473/page-103#post-9678736

 

[thomas15]

If you look at the shooters survey from the 2018 USPSA Nationals (in the Dec. Front Sight) you will see that the least used powders by those who spend the time and resources to attend that event are the same ones that are getting the most recs in this thread.

 

[thomas15]

The worse hands down during the great powder shortage was Western. They returned to the shelves almost a year after everything else was plentiful.

Back in 2014 or 15 when Alliant went on a BE-86 massive publicity binge, there was maybe 1 container load of that stuff available for over a year. People here were all besides themselves trying to find that stuff because no one had it but everyone on the chit-chat boards had an uncle that had a neighbor that's best friend's shooting buddy got one of those limited edition pounds of that stuff and thought it would be the last powder ever invented.

 

[LiveLife]

If you look at the shooters survey from the 2018 USPSA Nationals (in the Dec. Front Sight) you will see that the least used powders ... are the same ones that are getting the most recs in this thread.

Perhaps because they are "new" powders and many match shooters have not had a chance to do load development and comparison testing?

Besides, USPSA does not require utmost accuracy of bullseye match or highest muzzle velocities (especially for minor power factor) and many USPSA shooters will use the powder that is more economical per round and willing to sacrifice a bit of accuracy which means they will consider using powders that will take least amount of charge per load to save some money. Yes, I was one of them too.

When I started shooting USPSA, many told me they used Titegroup because it was "cheaper" than slower burning powders.

 

[ATLDave]

If you look at the shooters survey from the 2018 USPSA Nationals (in the Dec. Front Sight) you will see that the least used powders by those who spend the time and resources to attend that event are the same ones that are getting the most recs in this thread.

Well, they (we) are loading for a very specific purpose: getting good (not necessarily stellar) accuracy, hitting rule-specified power factors (momentum), minimizing recoil, and ensuring reliable function. Some throw in an additional parameter or two of being suitable for high-volume loading in terms of metering and low cost-per-round.

 

[Tony k]

I'm cursed in that I have a long memory that spans all the way back to the Great Smokeless Gunpowder Shortage (GSGS) of 2013-2015. During that time, for two long years, only one supplier of canister powders made any real attempt, anemic as it was, to supply the humble handloader, keeping us shooting. My loyalties go to the supplier that was there for me when no one else cared a wit. Not that I will chop my nose off to spite my face but if those two suppliers I mentioned had never returned to supplying canister powders no one would be any worse off today.

I also tend to find the constant pep rallies for certain brands of handloading related products to be a real turn-off. So while I don't obsess over any of this I steer clear of certain products where the rah rah is over the top.

I started reloading at that time because I wasn't able to find ammo. So you're saying it's no coincidence that all my first powders I was able to scrounge up between 2013 and 2015 were made by Win/Hodgdon/IMR? That supplier was actively trying to get powders to us, while alliant and western were only supplying ammo manufacturers?

 

[ATLDave]

That's funny. I also got into reloading just before the big shortage, but had little in the way of inventory stockpiled... so I remember the quest for powder all too well. Accurate/Western stuff was available near me at times that a lot of Hodgdon was unavailable... and I could just about be convinced that I didn't even see a bottle of Winchester pistol powder of any type for about 3 years.

I think this may be regional?

 

[Galil5.56]

FWIW, the great primer scare of the early 90's was no fun either... I was selling reloading gear and components then, and some of the stories were great. (time deactivated primers was a favorite). It WAS a real *&$%# to get any, let alone what you may have wanted.

 

[jeeptim]

I sold some reloading stuff on gunbroker during the dark quiet time.
I had an auction for 7.62x39 once fired F.C. brass 100ea started at 1 penny sold $74.00 + shipping.
Not my fault auction. I would have been happy with $10.00
Moral of the story...
Stock deep

 

[Toprudder]

Never mind.

 

[Charlie98]

Well, forgive me for saying this, but the usefulness of this thread has pretty much gone to crap.

It took a serious left turn at Albuquerque... that's for sure.

 

[thomas15]

I started reloading at that time because I wasn't able to find ammo. So you're saying it's no coincidence that all my first powders I was able to scrounge up between 2013 and 2015 were made by Win/Hodgdon/IMR? That supplier was actively trying to get powders to us, while alliant and western were only supplying ammo manufacturers?

During the time of the Great Smokeless Powder Famine, when every single firearms related chat forum had numerous threads on where to find stuff but still guys were bitching that they couldn't get anything, back then I placed about 100 pounds of pistol powder in my bunkers. Some of it Alliant, some Western the bulk being Hodgdon/IMR/Wincheser/VV. I haven't purchased powder since about mid 2015. I have sold off prolly 20 pounds and still it will be while before I need more.

Alliant and Western sell most of their powders 80+% to commercial loaders. This is no secret. A business decision to satisfy their commercial accounts first. Then that other company sells roughly 80 percent as canister products. Personally I don't care what powders or presses or bullets or even firearms anyone else uses but the simple truth is that both Alliant and Western gave handloaders low priority back then while other suppliers did their best.

 

[kcofohio]

Wow!!!
The variety of powder that can be used is amazing! Who'd a thunk!!

Yes, 9x19 enjoys one of the most varieties in published load data. One could almost make themselves dizzy from scanning through the data.

Many great suggestion for the powder you seek. It's a journey that makes it worth while.

 

[jeeptim]

The journey in reloading is the destination .
Time well spent!

 

[someguy2800]

Power pistol is my favorite. I suspect I would like BE-86 even more, but nobody local sells it.

 

[Nature Boy]

HP-38 seems to the the crescent wrench of pistol powders

 

[ArchAngelCD]

HP-38 seems to the the crescent wrench of pistol powders

I just agree with you!
I currently load for 8 handgun cartridges to one extent of another. I either use W231/HP-38 or "another powder" AND W231/HP-38. I would be lost without it.

 

[CMV]

During the time of the Great Smokeless Powder Famine, when every single firearms related chat forum had numerous threads on where to find stuff but still guys were bitching that they couldn't get anything, back then I placed about 100 pounds of pistol powder in my bunkers. Some of it Alliant, some Western the bulk being Hodgdon/IMR/Wincheser/VV. I haven't purchased powder since about mid 2015. I have sold off prolly 20 pounds and still it will be while before I need more.

Alliant and Western sell most of their powders 80+% to commercial loaders. This is no secret. A business decision to satisfy their commercial accounts first. Then that other company sells roughly 80 percent as canister products. Personally I don't care what powders or presses or bullets or even firearms anyone else uses but the simple truth is that both Alliant and Western gave handloaders low priority back then while other suppliers did their best.

I get where you're coming from. I have same feelings toward places like Botach Tactical and Cheaper Than Dirt due to their price gouging or taking orders (and $) for things they knew they didn't have in stock during the AWB - I didn't forget that and haven't bought from either since. But I didn't have any ill feelings toward component or ammo manufacturers for lack of supply during recent droughts. I have no idea how their businesses are set up, but they could have had contractual obligations preventing them from producing powder, primers, ammo, whatever for sale in distribution before meeting their OEM needs and I'm sure they don't have unlimited capacity in their plants and supply chain. My work is like that - a smaller customer who orders 1 thing per year isn't getting priority over a large OEM who orders many units per month. Even though there is more profit, longer lead time, and potential to turn the small customer into a larger one, not risking the established OEM or failing to meet contract obligations with them if the choice comes down I can only give one or the other what they want.

It just happened to be dumb luck for me - I didn't plan it. Just being miserly and overly concerned with cost per round for my reloads, buying very large amounts of primers, W231, H335, & projectiles just made economical sense so for that reason I had lots. That long drought was transparent to me. If I wanted every single caliber, every single bullet weight to have its own custom powder and primer recipe, no way I could afford stocking all that. But that's why I like the simplification and something like W231 that covers such a broad range.

If I think I need 1,000 primers, I need 15k. If I think I need a lb of powder, I need a several 8lb jugs. If I think I need a brick of 22LR, I need a couple cases. About the only thing I will buy in small qty is a projectile I want to see if I like - otherwise it just makes more sense - to me - to save the $ buying case qty's or maxing a single hazmat fee or taking advantage of a great sale price.....added benefit is droughts are transparent or I have plenty of trade commodities if I do want something else.

 

[thomas15]

If I think I need 1,000 primers, I need 15k. If I think I need a lb of powder, I need a several 8lb jugs.

Exactly right my friend. Of course it is not for me to tell anyone how to spend their money, as it isn't for anyone to tell me how to spend mine but buying powder in 1 pound containers or a box of 1000 primers when you shoot 10K per years is I think, silly. The exception (for me that is) is when I'm just trying out something, not material that I use on a regular basis.

 

[alfsauve]

If you look at the shooters survey from the 2018 USPSA Nationals (in the Dec. Front Sight) you will see that the least used powders by those who spend the time and resources to attend that event are the same ones that are getting the most recs in this thread.

For those who didn't or can't look it up: Titegroup is the #1 Powder in every class except for Limited and Revolver where it came in just 2% points under first place.

After reviewing that, which is why I started using Titegroup to begin with, I think I'll just stick with it.

 

[ATLDave]

There's no way Titegroup is the #1 powder in Open division.

ETA: In the survey, Hodgdon combined is 22% for Open powder. VV as a brand is 37%. Top powder is VV 3N38, Autocomp is 21%, HS6 is 12%, and VV 3N37 is 6%. Titegroup isn't on the list - it's not a powder useful for open guns, whether in 9mm or 38 super.