How to convert your liberal friends (to win next election)

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^ They have bad reputations but Pelosi is on record THIS YEAR saying no new gun laws and Reid brought the Thune Amendment on carry reciprocity to the Senate floor where it fell by ONE SINGLE vote. I'm no Democrat or liberal but I do not fear this Democratic congress restricting our gun rights. There are some antis in the congress but they have no power comparatively speaking and not nearly the votes to do anything about their positions.

My Congressman is a Democrat but he was the only guy from my state to vote for "allowing" us to carry weapons in National parks. That vote pretty much secured him my vote in 2010, unless the HC bill is really bad.
 
It's going to be difficult, but please abide by the NO POLITICS rule in this forum if you want your posts to remain.
 
Just a thought...
The more liberal gunowners there are, the safer our gun rights get.
If no one on the left or the right can take action against the Second Amendment without worrying about getting voted out during the next election... well I don't see how that's a bad thing.
 
Originally posted by MJU1983:
California Democrat

or,

"If someone is so fearful that, that they're going to start using their weapons to protect their rights, makes me very nervous that these people have these weapons at all." -U.S. Rep Henry Waxman, California Democrat

Two people I can't stand are in charge: Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid. No thanks!

You seem to be ignoring a lot of the facts and other things of historical importance.

Don't Blame Liberals for Gun Control.
 
I am going to try to put this in a way that will be ok with the mods.

Conversion of any person to having an interest in or positive perception of firearms is a good thing. The more people who have an interest from any party and the more our legislators from any party will need to abide by the will of the people. That's how democracy works.

The rhetoric about people either being anti or pro doesn't work here in the Northeast. I have found that people can be converted to have an interest in shooting through an inclusive argument and some plinking, not a divisive diatribe. Those who have no interest in shooting can be "converted" to support gun rights if a reasonable argument is presented. No need for "doom and gloom" or "rape and murder defense" scenarios, a simple explanation of why these rights are vital to our nation and how taking away rights is a slippery slope. The folks who are not interested in this argument also don't care about the "doom and gloom", "rape and murder defense" and other more extreme arguments.

Again, this is my experience in the part of the country where I was raised and live.
 
Oldskoolfan, point well taken and I was unaware of those facts (don't blame me I'm only 24, I don't remember much before Clinton) however I will point out the first ever Federal gun control NFA of 1934 was signed by FDR and the GCA of 1968 was signed by LBJ. Those are the two most important gun control acts in this country.
 
Oldskoolfan, this one quote from the link you just posted rings right out at me:

But the monolithic commitment America’s "ruling classes" have shown toward gun control makes one wonder whether even a president is free to buck the current.

There's the key right in there. Ruling classes. That's what it's about. It's about the powerful maintaining their ability to do what they will at the expense of all of us. This is done not only by stripping us of our right to defend ourselves and those around us, it is also done by fracturing us along political, racial, social and class lines. Pick a big group, set them against a smaller and less powerful group that's artificially inflated into a threat. Pick a belief system and tell them they're on the verge of being wiped out despite all evidence to the contrary. Pick a crisis and propose a solution that looks good on the surface even though you've gutted it so that it only benefits you and your own, no one else. We have a political system in this country in which it is patently impossible for anyone to run for higher office without being vetted by the powerful and the wealthy. They benefit from any and every government foray into authoritarianism, whether it's the further proliferation of corporate-run prisons, the development of "less than lethal" crowd control devices, looser regulation of surveillance, the militarization of police departments and naturally, gun control. They benefit and we lose.

In my mind, and I think I'm not alone here, there is no single earthly reason why someone can't be pro-firearm and pro-same-sex marriage, or pro-firearm and pro-choice, or what have you. The idea of being able to own a firearm for the purposes of self-defense does not conflict with a single thing I believe in. If anything, it lines up perfectly with them. It is a continuation of the idea of being secure in my own person and rejecting any and all attempts by authority to constrain behavior that harms no one and is frankly none of their damn business. Why more people don't see this, I'm not sure. What I do know is, I'm going to continue changing that whenever possible.
 
Oldskoolfan, this one quote from the link you just posted rings right out at me:



There's the key right in there. Ruling classes. That's what it's about. It's about the powerful maintaining their ability to do what they will at the expense of all of us. This is done not only by stripping us of our right to defend ourselves and those around us, it is also done by fracturing us along political, racial, social and class lines. Pick a big group, set them against a smaller and less powerful group that's artificially inflated into a threat. Pick a belief system and tell them they're on the verge of being wiped out despite all evidence to the contrary. Pick a crisis and propose a solution that looks good on the surface even though you've gutted it so that it only benefits you and your own, no one else. We have a political system in this country in which it is patently impossible for anyone to run for higher office without being vetted by the powerful and the wealthy. They benefit from any and every government foray into authoritarianism, whether it's the further proliferation of corporate-run prisons, the development of "less than lethal" crowd control devices, looser regulation of surveillance, the militarization of police departments and naturally, gun control. They benefit and we lose.

In my mind, and I think I'm not alone here, there is no single earthly reason why someone can't be pro-firearm and pro-same-sex marriage, or pro-firearm and pro-choice, or what have you. The idea of being able to own a firearm for the purposes of self-defense does not conflict with a single thing I believe in. If anything, it lines up perfectly with them. It is a continuation of the idea of being secure in my own person and rejecting any and all attempts by authority to constrain behavior that harms no one and is frankly none of their damn business. Why more people don't see this, I'm not sure. What I do know is, I'm going to continue changing that whenever possible.
Well put...and you are not alone here. I think there are many people of the same mindset all over, we just don't feel threatened enough to try to force our beliefs on everyone else. Frankly, that would go against the whole point anyway.

That said, I try to get people I know to enjoy shooting because it is something I can share with them. It's more of "Try this because it's fun" than a "You need to do this or you are un-American" sort of situation. As for telling people firearms are not dangerous, this is generally because they are a part of my life and so are firearms. This doesn't work for everybody. I am currently pro-firearm, pro-gay marriage, pro-choice and pro-death penalty so I am used to having everybody disagree with me on something.
 
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Oldskoolfan, you are right.

My apologies, I am not a fan of either party (R or D). To me they are exactly the same.

I would vote for anyone who is a strong supporter of the Constitution and 2nd amendment specifically.

I'm more of an anarchist, I want little to no Federal Government involvement in my life. They are out of control, and have been for the past 100 years...Political Party need not apply because it is BOTH of them.
 
I think now a days the label liberal or conservative has more to do with politics and social issues and little to do with gun rights. I have many friends who considered themselves Liberals who carry or have semi auto weapons at home for self defense.

At a class reunion a female friend I would have called a "hippie" was telling me her husband bought her, "his and her matching lugers for christmas".
She loves to shoot.

Conservatives are not the only ones armed to the teeth.
 
The ruling class comments are well taken - one can search on Goldman Sachs folks wanting pistol permits to protect from a 'populist' revolution. Also, Harper's magazine, IIRC, had an article on why progressives should support the RKBA.

I also discuss the issue in one of the URLs in my blog. The necessary connection of social conservatism and the RKBA is a terrible handicap for the RKBA and those who put it forward as a litmus test are missing the picture on firearms rights.
 
This is why dividing gunowners into "liberal" and "conservative" camps is just another tool to subvert all of us.

"Get the fools bickering among themselves and no one has to bother worrying about them."

We better get smart if we want to restore our rights to everyone.
 
I'm a liberal and a Democrat and I've probably owned guns longer than a lot of people on this board.

I know tons of Democrats who are pro gun and own guns.

I think the pro gun thing really cuts across party lines.

Really with the exception of Brady and the AWB which expired, since 1980 I think that at least in my perception gun laws and even the polling are mostly pro gun.

If you look at the pro gun stuff passed by the democratic congress you can see that #1 the Dems know anti gun legislation is a loser for them and #2 Given that firearms laws overall have progressively got more LENIENT and yet the crime rate continues to GO DOWN there is really no factual basis for instituting any more regressive gun laws.

The anti gun people by and large in my view are more of an urban/rural issue. The city people see guns mostly only used in crime and have no history of understanding how fun shooting and collecting guns is. The country people know this.

Recently turned a pal who has lived in NYC all her life and never held a gun onto shooting. Broke out the 10/22 in my yard and made the cans dance. She loved it. A couple years ago a few pals not liberal but their kids had never shot guns. Got them to do some shooting and they loved it.

I think it's not as much converting liberals people should be doing as educating the public about guns and how much good clean fun they are!!!:D
 
Leftist and Liberal are NOT the same thing! Heck, most of the political labels have been twisted far away from what they mean in the dictionary.

And by win the next election, is the OP talking about 2010 or 2012 and what candidate is he proposing? Myself, I plan on voting for just about any 3rd party candidate [within reason, they can't be a raving lunatic] in 2012 for Pres. I regret not voting for a 3rd party candidate last election as a protest vote.

It does surprise me that the "hippie" friend would have his and her Lugers. My sister seems to be leaning towards the hippie persuasion and she has t-shirts that say "arms are for hugging" and another one with a pic of a rifle with a rose in the barrel. I gave her the strangest look when she showed me some of her t-shirts when me and the wife visited at Christmas.

My sister also seems to think it's abhorrent to shoot at silhouette type targets :confused: She did finally come around to being ok with her husband getting a rifle though, so that's a start. I almost got her out to the range while I was there to try out my tacticool 22LR.
 
I am a liberal Democrat and worked my ass off to get Obama elected. I worked really hard. Door knocking, phone banking, and making food for my local Democratic Party headquarters. The most important thing in the world was to get this country on a better track. And we did it.

I'm a member of the NRA and have been for a very long time. My branch of the Democratic Party is very focused on the Second Amendment and what we do is keep the Democrats away from gun control issues. Gun control legislation loses votes and we've learned that. On this board, it is very, very important that you do not make the mistake of thinking that Democrats are opposed to CCW, private ownership, or any restrictions at all against gun ownership.

This is not a political issue. We are the Americans who take personal responsibility for our own safety. I'm on your side. You're on mine. The most important thing is that we are skilled and trained and worthy of the powerful instruments we possess.
 
The NRA is a lobbying group with a singular agenda of which I am a member. That said, the post you are responding to is alluding to the fact that there were others issues with this country he thought Obama was more equipped to deal with. Your link has nothing to do with anything you quoted and very little with what he said in the post. I agree with the NRA on many things but they are not my sole guiding light for my political decisions.
 
I don't try to convert people anymore. I just try to discourage them from voting.

Do like I did. Get a bumper sticker that reads, "My vote cancels out y'alls!"

:)
 
We need to redefine our tent as "RKBA Supporters" rather than DEMs v. GOP, red vs. blue, liberal vs. conservative.

Amen to that.

If someone has the attitude that the only way to protect RKBA is to spend all their time generating a vote against Democrats then they can kiss these goals goodbye in the long run. The roughly 50/50 split between Rep and Dem isn't going to change -- both parties will make sure of that by holding on to their respective power. However, the numbers of people - liberals and conservative alike - who support RKBA are actually growing -- unlike the numbers of people actually changing parties.


I stopped posting here for months and generally stopped caring about RKBA protection because of posts dismissing "liberals" as people who don't actually support RKBA (I'm a liberal and I support RKBA). This assumption is ignorant of the facts, ignorant of real people's beliefs and attitudes, and generally offensive to anyone who might be on the fence about this one particular issue who resents being labeled as narrow-minded political party.

Some people who claim to be "pro-RKBA" are content to narrow their world-view and deign to accept only those who wear "red." That's a great way to lose more ground than you gain.

A house divided cannot stand.
 
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shockwave: On this board, it is very, very important that you do not make the mistake of thinking that Democrats are opposed to CCW, private ownership, or any restrictions at all against gun ownership.

Here’s the 2008 Democratic Platform on firearms:
We recognize that the right to bear arms is an important part of the American tradition, and we will preserve Americans’ continued Second Amendment right to own and use firearms. We believe that the right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation, but we know that what works in Chicago may not work in Cheyenne. We can work together to enact and enforce common-sense laws and improvements, like closing the gun show loophole, improving our background check system and reinstating the assault weapons ban, so that guns do not fall into the hands of terrorists or criminals. Acting responsibly and with respect for differing views on this issue, we can both protect the constitutional right to bear arms and keep our communities and our children safe.

How does “reinstating the assault weapons ban” jibe with not being for “any restrictions at all against gun ownership“? Why would they mention “what works in Chicago” if they didn’t think Chicago’s handgun ban worked?

I know THR has a strict policy against saying anything negative about Democrats, but that shouldn’t mean we have to read nonsense about how Democrats aren’t anti-gun.
 
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