Modern combat with bolt action?

Status
Not open for further replies.
The Dread Pirate Roberts would be fine in modern combat with a bolt action, the six-fingered man... not so much! Unless they were fighting on top of the Cliffs of Insanity, whole different story.
Click to expand...
What about Inigo Montoya?
 
Let's not say a Mosin. Any Mauser would be a better choice.

And enough with The Princess Bride. There are lots of movie sites out there.

John
 
M28's run quite a bit these days, but you can get Tikka 91's, various M39's and other Finns for under $250. I've got an M91 Tikka that shoots light ball MOA that cost me $180 last year. The increase in price is not that much over a run-of-the-mill Soviet Mosin.

The main point is, the Finnish experience in the Winter War disproves the notion--expressed by some here--that a bolt action rifle is useless against a superior force. Flesh is still flesh, and the important elements are still communication, tactics and training. These matter much more than how big your tank is or how many rounds per minute you can fire from your rifle.
Click to expand...

Cosmoline: I never said that a mosin would be USELESS. I freely admit that a $79 off-the rack USSR mosin would be just fine for popping a few of them before they got you. If you were lucky, you could use it as a liberator. My primary SHTF weapon is a $89.00 M91/30 from Big 5. The difference is that I KNOW that rifle is at least 4moa (my standard for decent accuracy), probably better with good ammo. I know I can hit something out to 200-300 yards (or will once I get the new sights dialed in). Some off-the rack weapon may not even get 4MOA. I'd MUCH rather have a remington 700, Finnish mosin, SMLE, or similar rifle than an AK, or a late-war mosin. One of those weapons can get you a lot better range to make a couple of shots then get the hell out of dodge. My comments were strictly about the ultra-cheap, roll-of-the-dice off the rack mosins people pick up because they're cheap.

Also, even that $180 M91 you bought LAST YEAR is over twice the price of the cheapest store-bought mosins today. At the time you bought it, it was closer to 2.5 times the price. That's the difference between a rifle with a box of ammo, and a rifle with a crate of ammo. $180 would go a long way towards an SKS or an AK. I don't recommend cheap mosins to people for warfighting. I know mine would be OK, but that's only because I've tweaked it, and I'm still not satisfied.
 
sorry to tell you for modern combat, single shot is bad. Actually even though the m16 has semi auto mode, thats only allowed, at least from what they said in basic this year, to the IET handbook, only for long range shooting. Anything within 100 yards is meant for 3 round burst or full auto.
Its said but true.
 
Anything within 100 yards is meant for 3 round burst or full auto
Click to expand...

What? I never heard this in three years of infantry, including deployment. The only time I heard it suggested, was while moving in convoy.

John
 
Huh. My IET handbook certainly doesn't say that, but it's 9yrs old or so. We must have been better shots back in the day. :p
Course, I wasn't infantry like JShirley, but my drill sergeants were, and they weren't big fans of burst. Neither were the OPFOR guys at JRTC when I went. Course, they were high speed and had optics, so I guess they didn't need to spray. :D
 
guys, i just got booted out of basic this summer by a pencil pusher because he didnt like the waiver boards determination.

Thing is, what my DS taught my platoon. One was infantry adn rode around with his subservient troops in bradley vehicles. The other was Military Police.

They beat into us during all days of BRM education in the bay that for shots under 100 yards, you had to put the most possible bullets downrange at your opponent using burst or full auto if you had an M4.

And in the IET we had, i think it was a reprint or update on the 2006 edition, when it came to situations that needed accurate aiming, the distances listed were always over 100 yards or meters.
I wish i had my IET with me, but its down in Fort Benning. I had to turn it in with my CamelBak when i turned my battle rattle in.
 
The classic bolt action military rifles retains it's effectiveness in individual employment against point targets, with the potential for great accuracy in the right hands.

A rifle team fires volley shots in quick succession or fire alternately at rapid pace to gain an advantage.
 
I got out in 2000.
I was in the Army as a 12B for about a year and a half before being discharged for medical reasons.
During that time I only fired any M-16 on burst once.
The rest of the time, even during a spray and pray live fire night exercise, it was semi-auto only.
Burst was not just frowned upon, it was positively off-limits.
Realistically, burst and FA are kind of unnecessary in a regular issue rifle.

It isn't that hard to put three or four rounds into a pop-up target before it hits the ground on semi-auto if need be.

Also, what you read in the manuals is occasionally wrong.
Even if it's not wrong, it's often stupid.
There's the right way to do something, then there's the Army way to do something...
 
Okay. So what's the basic price of an SKS. i see roughly 200-300 dollars. But i may not get semi-auto. My brother is REALLY good at shooting, and i want to get him into competition shooting. He turned ten the 25 :) what's a good starting caliber for competition shooting. He already tools around shooting 22. I was thinking 308, but not sure.
 
I've seen SKS for not much over $200. It's not a competition rifle. It's a combat weapon. 3-4 MOA is about right. It has 10 rounds, semi-auto, fed by strippers. Basically a Russian version of the garand, more or less, but a less powerful round and less accurate. Uses same ammo as an AK.

As for competition caliber, it kind of depends on the competition. Lots of people shoot 308 for all kinds of things. Some people like to shoot .223. Those are probably the two most common.
 
In a combat/invasion scenario, a simple weapon (a pistol better than a rifle) to find an isolated soldier, shoot him and take his weapon/ammo would be the best course of action.

It was done in WW2 in occupied Europe, Vietnam, Afganistan (centuries over), the Philippines, Iraq, etc, etc......
 
I think you would be better off with a Yugo SKS. They are a bit more cost wise but the ammo is cheaper. In the end you are probably in the same place money wise for amount of ammo purchased with rifle. They are sturdy guns and will give you a quicker follow up shot...
 
In that Sci-Fi situation, if you lived through your first firefight you'd easily have a choice of weapons and ammo loot from the fallen.
 
There's a thread somewhere on this forum of a guy in Afghanistan whose team had two of those new, armored 'Cougars' blown out from under them by an IED out in the middle of open, desert country. The Talib then engaged them at 400 to 600 meter ranges, which is at the very limit of an M4 or SAW's range. At those ranges, a bolt action is VERY handy, especially against dismounted troops in wide open country. I have an 03/A3 M1 Springfield and I can hit accurately at up to 500 yards with that rifle, and they've been used for years at up to 1000 yards.

No, for CQB a bolt action isn't much good. But in wide open desert country like there is here in Nevada (or Afghanistan), you can put a whole bunch of folks in a world of hurt if you know what you're doing.
 
No, for CQB a bolt action isn't much good. But in wide open desert country like there is here in Nevada (or Afghanistan), you can put a whole bunch of folks in a world of hurt if you know what you're doing
Click to expand...

That is the reasions why the soviets developed the SVD, as they wanted a squad/platoon to have some longer range abilities. Or so I have been told ;)

just my .02 lira
 
WOW! SVD's are expensive!
Click to expand...

:cuss::cuss::cuss:

Its sad as I always wanted one, but I don't think I can afford one unless the importing of them is reopened.

(From what I understand, they are no longer allowed to be imported, and thus the high high prices, can anyone confirm this?)

guess I will buy a mosin ;)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

A
  • Locked
What is good accuracy out of a military surplus bolt action or modern semi-auto?
Replies
10
Views
1K
George S.
G
M
  • Locked
Bolt Actions for a Modern Army
2 3 4
Replies
81
Views
4K
1911Tuner
1
N
  • Locked
If you were to make a new bolt-action battle rifle...
2 3
Replies
62
Views
3K
USSR
U
S
  • Locked
Usefullness of 30-30 in "Modern Combat"
2 3 4 5 6 7 8
Replies
178
Views
27K
Art Eatman
A
G
  • Locked
Slicking up a Mosin bolt?
Replies
7
Views
560
White Horseradish
W
Back
Top