Wow!-- what a breakdown, it seems like it is all down on paper--sturdy really did they homework---i see no responce to that--must be true
The guy that "put it all down on paper" just admitted in this thread that he was making unknown assumptions regarding his math.
I don't know if it "must be true".
He's giving AMSEC the benefit of the doubt. Assuming AMSEC uses the best available composite thermal insulator, i.e. one composed of perlite, the question is how fast is heat flow into the safe.
Is it the best? I have no idea. Does AMSEC use in in any of their safes? I have no idea. Do they use it in their BF safes? I have no idea.
All of these manufacturers use "proprietary" mixtures of materials to achieve their goals. In other words, they don't say what's in them. Short of performing an examination of the material, there's no way of knowing what's in it.
I know he hasn't examined the material, because he can't even differentiate between body putty and drylight in a photo. I posted a photo of the first version of drylight. It doesn't look anything like the photo of perlite that was posted.
As I have stated in previous threads, the smaller BF safes, built in an almost identical fashion as their gun safes, carry a UL fire rating. As such, we know that the insulation is capable of protecting against heat, as UL has the most stringent fire test that exposes safes to worst case scenarios.
Out of the thousands and thousands of safes that carry UL fire labels, nobody can point out ONE that uses ceramic insulation as its primary insulation. So this means one of two things: a) nobody has ever submitted a safe with ceramic insulation for testing, or b) safes with this insulation have been submitted and failed.
Ceramic insulations have been around for many years. There are many safes with UL fire ratings that are VERY expensive, so cost is certainly not a factor. I am making an assumptiong (and I admit it up front) that the ceramics don't perform as well as some think they do. If they did, they would certainly be found in more safes, and in safes with UL labels.
The point he's trying to make is to spread misinformation about AMSEC to try and tarnish their reputation.
AMSEC will be here shortly to correct his misinformation. Wait, they're too busy selling safes.
Hey wait.....wasn't he getting mad at you Frank and accusing you of the same thing about Sturdy? Hmmmmm, sounds a little hypocritical to me.
The difference was, he accused me of spreading misinformation when I didn't. He's actually doing it, and denying it.
I pointed this out earlier in this thread. It's the same tactic used by certain political parties.
Hey look! AMSEC even puts drylite in the hinges!
It's oooozing out the hole! Fireproof hinges....I hope they patented that!
Here's my rough sketch of what's shown in the "hole" picture. The black is steel, the red is weld, and the green is body putty. I should have made it a bit larger to make it easier to see, but you get the idea.