Toys 'R' Us: Boycott.

[Gouranga]

GRNC in NC is on-board and has notified members statewide to boycott TRU. They issued their alert tonight:

"Like the Grinch stealing Christmas, Toys R Us wishes to do so with your Constitutional rights. Like so too many others before, Toys R Us wants you to surrender your rights before handing over your money. In the popular vein of catering to liberal sensitivities rather than cold hard reality, the popular toy store is making you less safe by prohibiting concealed carry in their stores.


Will you allow this without protest, or will you let Toys R Us know they can celebrate this Christmas without your money? "

I would urge any and all state orgs out there to join in with this. If you are a member make sure your leadership is aware of this, let's hit them with a major nationwide boycott now.

 

[hso]

A CEO will be protected from outsiders "bothering" them. Either the Boss will demand their IT department block the email flooding their in-box, their Executive Assistant will demand it since they screen all the mail for him/her anyway, or an IT department that's on its toes will catch the increased activity and move to filter the mail.

Antagonizing the CEO or President of TRU will only lead to resistance to accepting what we're telling them. Our need is to educate TRU management to the fact that permit holders are not a risk of violence and open their eyes to the fact that the policy is prejudicial and not fact based. To do that we need to have as many people as possible to politely but firmly repeat the same message to them AND we need to show them that there's an economic impact to discriminating against us by proving the money they might have gotten has gone to their competition.

The obvious course of action is to continue the email campaign directed at Ms. Albano. Increase the volume of snail mail to Mr. Storch. Try to get as many RKBA advocacy groups as possible to do the same and get the 2A media personalities to get involved so the non-internet 2A community can participate in the effort.

The talking points are -
1) No facts support the policy and postings against law abiding potential customer who legally carry coming into their stores.
2) Such a policy is based on prejudice and is discriminatory. Equating us to criminals is insulting and unacceptable.
3) We will spend our money at businesses that do not have these prejudicial policies instead of TRU as long as TRU has this policy and these postings in place.

Anyone else think of any talking points chime in.
3)

 

[snubbies]

Unacceptable????

You obviously didn't read my post. I never advocated concealed carry in violation of their policy. I advocated notification of store management when you come on store premises after negotiation. This tactic presumes the negotiation will change to allow carry under the conditions I described. Repeated e-mails snail mail chanting the same montra is harassment of management. I predict your tatctics will not achieve your goals.

 

[F-Body Demon]

Emailed. Will spread the word.

 

[thx997303]

snubbies,

I never claimed you advocated concealing in spite of the signs, I was merely comparing it to something else.

And the goal of this boycott, well I wouldn't say it's to get them to change their policy, so much as it is to not spend money with a company that believes we are dangerous people.

If they change their policy, I would stop calling for a boycott based on their firearms policy.

I really think you are looking at this from the wrong angle.

 

[snubbies]

Goal???

If the goal is to punish them for their gun policy why all the e-mail and snail mail?? It seems that some of the other members have a different goal. I read many of the postings that advocated the writing campaign to change the policy. Advocating a boycott for the sole purpose of punishment for their policy can be done without the writing campaign. I assumed from the outset the goal was to change the policy. If that in fact is not the goal I will cease and desist my comments. If you want the ploicy changed then I reiterate my position that a letter writing campaign alone will not do it. You can see from TRU's response they have taken steps to counteract your efforts.

 

[CHEVELLE427]

lack of money will always get there attention as it is connected to bonus checks for the year as well profit

 

[thx997303]

snubbies,

As with all boycotts, the point is to "punish" the business for something you don't like.

The "punishment" continues as long as it's necessary. If they change the policy, the "punishment" is no longer necessary.

Your approach would require them to actually WANT to negotiate. It's obvious at this point that will not happen.

I have just sent an e-mail out to Tom Gresham in the hopes of getting him to at least mention the boycott.

If he takes up the cause then the boycott will grow and perhaps TRU wont be so apt to simply ignore gun owners.

 

[snubbies]

Lack of money

When there is a lack of money the first people to suffer are the underlings through layoffs. This is brought true in the Banking crisis we just went through. The people lost and the executives took bonuses. People in the stores and on the docks will be the first to suffer. There will be no money to hire and the economy suffers. Do we want to punish or do we want to correct a bad policy??? Pardon my ignorance, Who is Tom Gresham??

 

[thx997303]

So I imagine you are for the stimulus packages.

I'm not interested in debating with you.

I'm also not interested in compromising.

Thank you for your input, your opinion has been noted.

Tom Gresham is the host of a radio show called Gun Talk. It airs every sunday across the nation.

 

[snubbies]

Punish

They won't negotiate when we are confrontational. We never approached them in a way that would want them to at least talk to us. The first e-mails and letters posted here were threatening. This effort began with screaming on the premises floor. They are in the drivers seat since there is no law to compel them to change their policy. The boycott can last forever and the policy will stay the same without cooperation of TRU. What if other large chainstores, Walmart, K-Mart, and the rest follow TRU's lead. To advance the cause by bringing others on board is the first step. A mistake we may be making here is overestimating our power.

 

[snubbies]

Compromise

Those that refuse to compromise have taken the first step toward failure.

 

[CHEVELLE427]

i could care less if they ever change there no guns allowed sign,

that is there right as it is my right to choose were to spend my money.

im not seeing how that hurts the economy as there is a set amount of money that will be spent somewere just not at toy r us. so the economy is not taking the hit because people will still need that toy and will buy it just not at TRU,

only ones that it will affect is the poor worker bee , and when there gone so will, TRU, and just maybe the worker bee's will find a new job at the toy store that just got an incress in sales because they were more gun friendly to the people that spen money.

 

[snubbies]

Deceived!!!

I am sure there are those that have sent letters and e-mail genuinely felt their efforts were directed at changing a policy they perceived as unjust or discriminatory. Apparently they and I have been deceived if what Chevelle says is the consenus of the members.

 

[hso]

The only consensus here is that the TRU policy is unjust and/or discriminatory and that a grassroots approach is being followed in this thread to motivate TRU to change the policy to a gun owner neutral policy.

Some see asking them to reconsider as the approach to take. Some see asking them to change the policy as well as denying them their business as the approach to take. Both approaches, and others, have been clear from the start. The only approach that I'd rather members not take is simply refuse to darken a TRU door ever again without sending an explanation as to why so that TRU has a chance to see they have options with gun owners that they can regain the trust and business they loose.

 

[CHEVELLE427]

i feel policy will change when the bottom line on money making changes.

if gun owners spend there money else were on the bias of no guns allowed in there store.

policy will change or TRU will suffer a loss.

the more they loose the more they might think there change was not the right call ,
same as the change this country has been forced to do in the past 2 years.

we are working on changing it back as well.

 

[snubbies]

Never return to TRU

Unfortunately that is the result of this for some of the members. If you want to control the tone of the boycott HSO take charge.

 

[Old krow]

Anyone else think of any talking points chime in.

Just my .02; The policy ONLY restricts law abiding citizens from carrying concealed weapons putting the law abiding citizen, or children of said law abiding citizen in harms way.

There is statistical evidence to back this up. I'd have to search for the studies again, but recent shootings prove the case.

I'm a little confused on the "punishment" thing. Looks like you guys are splitting hairs.

It is more likely that an insurance company/policy is driving this to try and save money on costs and liability. If that is the case, the bottom line is the only reasonable target.

Those that refuse to compromise have taken the first step toward failure.

In some cases I would agree, in this case I do not, and this is why; It's a blatant disregard for my families' security so that they can save a couple dollars. I am not a "gun owner" to them, I am a customer. They do not care about my rights or my safety, only my money. If they do ANYTHING to make me think this is not the case it is only to make me feel secure enough to spend money there.

This road to hell is paved with good intentions and a compromise is meeting the devil halfway.

 

[snubbies]

Compromise

OLD KROW

If the compromise reached would allow licensed individuals to conceal carry would your resistance be satisfied??? I can't get my head around the safety concerns. I grant that being armed gives you a better chance of survival but is no guarantee. Does anyone know the probability factors of being shot in a place of business vs. the street or other public place. Can someone give me the basis of the contention TRU has violated their rights. There is no law or statute that guarantees the right to carry a gun on private property without permission of the owner. The law has excluded the right to carry in public areas such as schools so the right to carry is not absolute. It is controlled by the State, witness Illinois and Wisconsin.

 

[Old krow]

Snubbies,

I can't get my head around the safety concerns.

It is no guarantee at all, but it does help the odds. I'll give you an example and I hope that nobody takes this the wrong as it is an issue that I am somewhat close to. I certainly do not mean to disgrace the soldiers that died there. The incident at Fort Hood; if only %25, or even %10 of the people there were armed would there have been as many people die? No doubt people would have died, but knowing that 1/4 or 1/10 could kill him before he did the damage he did would he have reconsidered.

Doesn't somebody here have a quote that reads "in a situation where seconds count the police are only minutes away?"

Can someone give me the basis of the contention TRU has violated their rights.

If it were really an issue of "violation" it could go to court and be resolved. It isn't and it is their right. It is also my right to shop elsewhere. To not let them know WHY is to merely punish them with no hope of an outcome that's beneficial to anyone. I keep my CCW, they get money, we're all one big happy family. Those are the terms of the arrangement. As far as a state banning CCW then that's a separate issue. What's ironic is that I don't CCW. I understand THX's point and I personally do not believe that we should give up ground.

I agree that there's power in numbers and a unified front should be chosen. The only real question that I have is how are we representing ourselves? Have we chosen? Many have said "hit the bottom line" and that is viable IMO, but at the same time we need to let them know why we're unhappy and it looks like email is out. How about a petition? Utilize the radio show seems like a great idea.

 

[CHEVELLE427]

better chance of survival but is no guarantee

true, but i do know one thing.

i wont be getting shot for free. unless it is into my back.

if this was not a concern with the public now days their would not be a run on CCW permits. and all would be safe in the world, and the bad guys would just keep to killing each other. but any gun free zone is a hot zone for crime

 

[gretzfan]

Choice

I’m not an attorney; however, when I shop Toys R Us I ignore the open carry sign if one is posted. I will not inconvenience myself and family by searching for an alternate store to take my business. Nor will I waste time sending emails to corporate generating a generic response. As far as I’m concerned I am going to conduct business in the store as I normally would. You are not breaking a law you are ignoring a store policy. A policy often interpreted by on duty store employees. By policy Toys R Us employees are not allowed to confront or accuse a shopper that commits a theft, even if they personally witness the crime. Theft is a crime, not a simple store policy.
If I was legally carrying and staff refused to accept my transaction I would politely inform them that I was not violating any law. I would explain that if I left my firearm in the car it would be unsafe and against the law. I am a responsible person and I’m confident Toys R Us would not condone this unsafe and illegal conduct. As soon as I pay, I’ll be on my way.
If they continued to refuse service I would politely ask that they call the police. If the employee is not allowed confront a customer they observed commit theft, chances are they will be unwilling to call police for fear of violating company policy. Defamation of character lawsuits are very expensive for the business to defend not to mention the enormous payouts when substantiated. The company mandates letting known theft suspects leave the store with unpaid merchandise considering it a, “Cost of doing business.”
Chances are they are just going to ring you up. If they refuse politely inform them that you will call police yourself and step to the side. If other customers are in line allow them to complete transactions in front of you while you wait. Up to this point, at least in my state, you have not come close to violating any law, nor should you- ever.
Call police and tell the dispatcher you are in a business dispute with TOYS R US employees and request a, “Civil stand-by.” The police will not be dispatched to a criminal investigation rather a civil dispute. Similar to, “I broke up with my boyfriend and he won’t give me my shoes back.”
If Toys R Us still refuses to conduct your transaction wait for police. When they arrive expect them to ask for your identification. Let them know you are legally carrying and OFFER to let them remove your gun from the holster for safekeeping during the incident. Chances are they will tell you, “You are on private property. They have the right to refuse service if they wish.”
At this point politely tell the officers you understand. Ask store employee’s if they intend to have you arrested for trespassing while exercising your constitutional rights. With the exception of trained loss prevention, employee’s are not permitted to arrest a customer for theft and certainly not permitted to arrest someone based on their interpretation of trespassing.
In my state you can’t be arrested from a retail establishment unless you’re advised that you are trespassing and then refuse to leave. Police cannot force you to leave unless the store is willing to prosecute and by policy they can’t. Politely leave the store anyway and thank the police. Tell the manager and store employees that you feel the store did not treat you fairly and you intend to seek legal advice.
Worst case scenario you will create a hornets’ nest at corporate. Toys R Us will have to notify cooperate regarding law enforcement inside the store and they must notify the legal department when litigation is brought up. Contact corporate yourself; tell them how embarrassed you were when the store called police on you when you did not commit a crime. If you called, tell them you were discriminated against and the store RUFUSED to call police when you asked. Tell corporate that Toys R Us threatened you with arrest if you didn’t leave. Let them know how embarrassed you were, how unfair you were treated and discriminated against for doing nothing more than exercising your rights, and that you reserve the right to seek legal advice.
The legal department will be forced to consider the current policy. You will have far more exposure from the incident in the store versus a simple email.
Best case scenario is the store manager or employee allows you to complete the transaction, even if it’s just to, “Get you out of the store.” If you complete a transaction be sure to identify the manager and employees working. Send a thank you letter to corporate. In the letter identify the store by number and location and thank all employees by name and then post your letter here.
If Toys R Us contests your future open carry purchase repeat the above and ask why you are being discriminated against when past practice has allowed you to make a purchase under the identical circumstances.

 

[CHEVELLE427]

Choice

GOOD LUCK WITH THIS , KEEP US POSTED.

in FL if there is a sign NO GUNS,you better not get caught with one , believe it is a misdemeanor but you just might be charged with what ever they see fit to charge you with.
will have to search for the rule, but as i remember it we can carry,, except IN fed buildings, school's, school functions,hospitals and old folks homes and were a sign says NO GUNS. AND ANY WERE ALCOHOL IS SERVED FOR CONSUMPTION ON PROPERTY

 

[hso]

Legal advice is usually valid only for a specific jurisdiction and dangerous to generalize as if it were universally applicable. It is critically important to understand what ALL the laws in your jurisdiction are before performing what is essentially a form of passive resistance to injustice. IOW, know what all the laws in your area say before you sit at the lunch counter or go to the drinking fountain. By law in TN, ignoring a simple circle slash sign is a felony for a HCP holder and could result in the HCP holder loosing their right to carry or possess any firearm. Knowing this tells people in my state just what the consequences can be of any attempt to protest a bad policy or law so they can make an informed decision about what they may face. Know the law for your jurisdiction before taking a direct action approach in protest of private business policies or local/state/fed law.

Being proactive and working to have the "gunbuster" postings removed from all stores in all states helps all gunowners everywhere and even the businesses who've made the mistake of deciding to put them up.

 

[snubbies]

Know the Law!!

Every State and every jurisdiction has different laws rules and regulations covering trespassing. Every place of business has the right to refuse you service and escort you from the premises. This has nothing to do with rights to carry a firearm in accordance with State & Federal law. Calling the Police will provide the means for the store to enforce the trespassing issue. I don't know all of the States Laws in this matter so what I say here may not be exact. In those States where it is a misdemeanor or even a felony why would anyone risk arrest and charges to prove a point.