WWB "self-defense" ammo

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FCastle88 said:
Yes, any hollowpoint can fail, but some do so more often than others. It's like buying a car, any car can break down, but you look for a model that is less likely to have problems. I've shot the WWB 147 gr JHP, and it had noticeably less recoil than 147 gr Gold Dots, causing me to believe that it's a bit underpowered. I've also had WWB FMJ that the bullets weren't seated properly, and some that had significantly less recoil than the rest of the rounds in the box, so I'm not comfortable carrying any WWB ammo. My safety is well worth paying $30 for a 50 pack of Gold Dots or HST once or twice a year.
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You're preaching to the choir...And its not like buying a car, if car's had failure rates in the high 40% to middle 60% range, we wouldn't have any! Hollowopoints, as often as not, fail to expand, or expand too rapidly.

The one factor of supreme importance in handgun ballistics, the one thing that absolutely must take place, is penetration! WWB is a bulk product, that means that its QC is also a by-product of bulk production methods...
 
WWB jhp is fine for sd / hd in any gun it will fire through. Just do a you tube search. People have ran tons of tests on it.
 
Objective evidence.

Thanks, okespe04. The fact that people say, "I like/don't like" this or that of guns and/or ammo is just that: likes and dislikes. But I prefer objective evidence, and I feel safer making decisions in such serious matters as defense on hard, objective evidence.
 
over-penetration has never, ever been the problem with 9mm FMJ ammo, the problem is under-cavitation.
 
whew, look at us go. Some have had problems with WWB, others haven't. I have burned up 1000 rounds of .45ACP WWB in the last couple of months since I bought my XD, never a single issue. I have also plinked off over 200 rounds of gold dots, no problems, 100 or 150 rounds of Ranger SXTs, no issues, in fact, I can't remember the last time that I had a centerfire cartridge fail on me, period. For this reason I have faith in my WWB, and even though I can afford fancy Speer bullets right now, I wouldn't hesitate to blast a baddie with WWB.
 
.45 WWB JHP's have always tested well, not so much for 9mm though. All the testing I've seen for the 230gr .45 shows it always expanding and often being .95-1.00" with plenty penetration.

The guys saying JHP ammunition hasn't advanced much...depends. They are tweaking the designs of the bullets for very specific performance. Yesterday's JHP designs definitely would clog more (bad) and when expansion began tend to shed more of the jacket/or all of it (which I actually like).

You can find 147gr HST 9mm ammunition for $25/50rd, I'd just go WWB for .45 spare mag (or primary).
 
The only potential problem I can see from using Walmart Winchester hollow points. Is due to what is meant for on the box, it states its intended use is for hunting and is also used for self defense ammo.

The only issue is that my CCW instructor told us not to use any ammo that says it is intended for hunting use at all. Even though it still states to be used in self defense.

His major issue was in our current state you still can be sued civilly after a criminal trial and for the added cost of $20 a box for premium self defense ammo, (do you want the plantiffs attorney pointing out to the jury or judge that the ammo you used stated for hunting use on it).

Note hornandy or remington golden saber only states self dense or law enforcement.

Note if you have a castle doctrine in your state it really doesn't matter, unless you get into a shooting in a public place, where your home , car, or motel room can't be used as a castle defense.

You can argue this all you want, I'm just telling you what our CCW instructor told our class and he told us he has testified for and against a lot of ppl in civil trials relating ammo type used in a shooting.

Agree with it or Not.
 
Good for you. The problem is that I have had several misfires with them
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I'm not trying to be a smart%@@, but if "MY" life were on the line; I wouldn't carry your pistol.
 
correction: just talked to ccw instructor and as long as the box of ammo says for self defense or personal protection on it then you are fine, even if it says hunting or target on it. As long as it says DEFENSE OR PERSONAL PROTECTION ON IT TOO.

So WWB hollow points are fine as long as you follow the info above.
He also said stay away from FMJ , ball or solid lead no matter what they say on the box.
 
I've seen online test's where WWB HP's failed to expand. Essentially they were FMJ's. This is just what I saw online, not first hand experience. I know you can definitely do much better for defense ammo. Why not carry something that you know has a good track record?
 
I have shot countless thousands of WWB 9mm FMJs from Walmart and never had an ignition problem. I have also shot approaching a thousand rounds of WWB defensive JHP ammo (there is a little black pistol logo on the side of the box) and they too have gone bang every time. Additionally, all of the ammo has fed reliably and I would trust my life with them. I currently have my pistol loaded with the basic Remington 115 grainers (JHPs) after shooting about 150 of them and feel they are good to go as well. I must say I find it odd that so many have had problems with WWB and misfires and I not a one!
 
why wouldnt WWB FMjs be effective for SD? too many people take the FMJ bullets for granted when they can do some serious damage, not as much as a JHP but they can become an effective manstopper .

i prefer the JHP but if FMJ was all i had sure why not .
 
Sorta a thread hijack but along the same lines... I read threads about HP and speciality ammo and big chunks of lead flying at supersonic speeds for SD... and i know the answer is it depends.... but how much does it really take to stop us "weak" humans. I say weak because I have unfortunately seen 175lbs whitetail deer run 200 yards after a .338 goes thru both shoulders -- kinda sad really -- but none the less.... I would be quite sure that there are NO humans on earth who can run after a .338 hits them... in the whole scheme of things our minds are a lot more potent than our bodies....what does it really take to stop a human -- I've "heard" stories of drugged up people being shot 15 times and still come at ya...and etc...
I'm not questioning is a HP necessary bc\ it's a game of risk -- and we have less risk shooting anything with a HP than we would a FMJ-- I just wonder if these specialty ammo that are $20 for a 5pack are really necessary....and you always read contradicting ballistics -- but those aren't guided or approved by any agency so you never know what to really beleive.
 
FMJ or Ball ammo are a plain NO NO . You can't take the risk on them over penentrating and hitting a person in another room, another home or in a public place.

You could be cleared in a criminal trial using FMJ ammo on a robber example. But if one of your FMJ bullets over penentrate and kill or injury an innocent person you could be found guilty of lesser manslaughter charge etc.

This is why its really better to get some thing like hornandy criticle defense ammo, it may cost more but you can be sure your carrying some of the best and most legal ammo you can use for CCW or defense.
 
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You could be cleared in a criminal trial using FMJ ammo on a robber example. But if one of your FMJ bullets over penentrate and kill or injury an innocent person you could be found guilty of lesser manslaughter charge etc.
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wrong
 
I had 2 jams out of 150 rounds with WWB fmj in my Glock 22 that I used to own, and my buddies brand new glock 22 had one jam out of the 50 he had. (separate occasions) It was the only ammo that ever jammed in my glock when I had it. For SD, I don't take chances, I stick with Hornandy XTP or Remington Golden Sabers. IMO its worth the extra money for the peace of mind. But hey if WWB jhp cycles in your gun more power to you, but don't think its going to out preform Hornandy.

and 918v, xr1200 is not wrong, that could happen a lot easier than you think.
 
918V, so your saying that if you shoot a robber in a store parking lot and use FMJ and one of the bullets goes thru the robber and hits and kills a young kid that is behind the robber.

Then your trying to tell us that the DA is not going to press or pursue any charges against you for the death of the child.
 
Nope. Under common law, if the use of force is justified an accident resulting from that use of force cannot result in criminal liability. This is the case in every state. In CA, our jury instructions specifically address this circumstance.

If you fire at the robber, but miss and strike the kid, you are OK criminally. Civilly, you are done. You will be homeless in a jiffy.

If you hit the robber, but the bullet exits and strikes the kid, you are OK criminally, but not civilly.

FMJ bullets do not exit all the time. They do not exit in line with the entrance wound all the time. A FMJ bullet may hit dead square in the chest and exit out the side. So can a hollowpoint. You will never know.

The best thing to do is to hold your fire until nobody else is around, but that is an impossibility in most cases.
 
This thread has degenerated well pass the OP's question and certainly doesn't belong here in Autoloaders.

If you want to debate the legality of shooting certain rounds and the resulting liability, please start a thread in Legal

We're done here
 
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