You might just be a Mall Ninja if:

[keeleon]

First off, I am proud of my Mall Ninjaness. I have never worked a day of security, and wouldn't be able to. I'm way too nonconfrontational. But I love carrying around all of my gadgets, and having my zombie survival kit in my trunk, and wearing way too much tacticool gear when playing airsoft. that doesn't make me a bad person, because I don't try and act like I'm a badass, I just like "tacticool".

And like has ben said before, SGs are just like any other job. People make fun of janitors, they make fun of frycooks, hell as a netowrk administrator, do you think I hear my share of stereotypes (which I gladly fit, btw.) the thing about "black and white" earlier would actually make a lot more sense if they were switched, and you know what, stereotypes exist for a reason. You might not be that stereotype, or you might just be part of it, but they exist because at some point a majority of the things we think about in a certain "culture", have to come fro msomewhere, and it certainly isn't just one guy that causes it all. Are there stereotypes (positive or negative) about gun owners? Do all of us fit all of them? But I bet ALL of us exhibit SOME of them.

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

and everyone knows a guy how epitimizes the stereotype
mine wasa kid named adam who took a 30%paycut to work security at a mall. armed. he would come home at nite take a shower and where is gun belt over his bathrobe. harmless but a lil scary if you didn't know him

 

[357WheelGun]

If I take it personally, it's because I feel like a set of people whom I respect do not respect me or my work.

Try working in Human Resources.

I am a Business Analyst/System Configurator and I spend my time designing, implementing, and configuring HR systems like SAP, but because of a quirk in my company's org structure, my department reports up through HR rather than IT. I tell people that I work for HR and they think I'm going to try to make everyone hug or something and immediately assume that my degree is probably in something like "18th Century Doilies".

Unfortunately, since I _do_ work in HR, I know why people make those assumptions about anyone who does work in HR. The people making HR policy and performing non-systems work actually _do_ mostly fit the stereotypes.

Similarly, the reason that people tend to dislike security guards is because, for probably 90% of the population, their only interaction with security guards is when one of the minority of jerks in the profession is on a power trip. As you point out, the good security guards don't bother people. So a law-abiding person really never encounters a security guard unless they are being harassed by one. The guards at my office are great guys (except for one really, really creepy guy who had a habit of following the women in the office around, but I haven't seen him in a month, so I think that got taken care of), but I've also seen some really heavy-handed power-tripping by retail security. I think that most people just simply have not had a positive experience with Security because when good Security Guards do their job right, no-one notices them.

 

[siglite]

he would come home at nite take a shower and where is gun belt over his bathrobe.

I cannot envision a normal circumstance where I'd want to see any guy in his bathrobe, but... hahah...

TTIWWOP

 

[cassandrasdaddy]

while adam was the kinda gut that brought up the old saw about shaving one end of a dog and teaching it to walk backwards he had a gorgeous sister that had bad taste in men (me)

 

[lonegunman]

I live in a town where the cops work hand in hand with criminals to insure crime stays high. When druggies rented the house across the street from mine the cops stopped by Thursdays and drive-by dope peddling began about three hours later and ran through the weekend. When you called or stopped by the COPS community support center. The cops looked at you bewildered and said, "we never heard of a complaint from that address".

One loud drug soaked night, the neighbors called to report a violent fight in the yard at 3am, the PD shows up, rounds up the head druggie and stands in the street pointing to homes of complaining neighbors. This results in druggies standing in peoples yards screaming at them. The cops? they headed back to their hideout.

This went on for about two years, I called at least a dozen times myself for explosions, drug dealing, fights, theft and abandoned cars. EVERY SINGLE time I got the same response. "We have never recieved a complaint about that house" or no response.

I have buddies that cop in different cities where they place honestly at a premium. Occasionally, I would have a bbq with a couple of Crown Vics in my driveway. This scared the druggies and they tended to leave me in peace.

This town had an entire apartment complex infested with 24/7 drug dealers. It took dozens of state and federal LEOs and a huge raid to shut it down. Local law enforcement only stopped to help it's customers move to new digs.

We have a new police chief and mayor these days. I'd care but I moved out of town. I feel safer a dog and a fence.

Pick on mall ninjas if you like, I think some of the jokes are funny too. I am happy to see anyone willing to do anything these days. There are plenty of crooked cops and lazy useless cops to go around, they have no room to run their gobs. Spare me the "thin blue line" story.

 

[xsquidgator]

he would come home at nite take a shower and where is gun belt over his bathrobe.

Har har! Anthony, is that you?!?

This reminds me so much of my apartment manager 20 years ago when I lived in some crappy student apartments. "Anthony" was a pudgy little toad of a dude who was a probation officer or something during the day, and the live-in apt. manager at other times. His idea of a good time was to come back to the apartments in the late afternoon wearing a 3 piece suit, and head directly to the pool. Once at the pool, he'd pick up the pool skimmer pole and 'nonchalantly' walk around skimming the pool surface. Of course, he'd take off his suit coat and put it on a chair first so all the girls could see that he was wearing a .38 in a belt holster.

What a picture, short pudgy guy with glasses, wearing a tie and a vest but no jacket, holstered .38, skimming the apartment pool trying to impress the ladies. Anthony was a mall ninja 20 years before we knew what one was!

 

[The Tourist]

Gunbelt on a bathroom, heh? Yikes, I didn't know our "urban warriors" were at the ready 24/7, even in their Underoos.

"Keeping Your City Safe, The Thin Blue Elastic Waist Band."

To be fair, if that's possible, there are wannabees in every faction. I see them constantly over in my shop's "road clothes" area buying every piece of leather or chrome they can afford. Then they wobble out of the parking lot on a pristine new Sportster.

So, it's not really the job of being a mall ninja that bothers me, it's the hype and the war stories.

I don't think there's a single person here who falls for the hype, but I'll bet you folks would stand in line to shake the hand of a guy who studies his craft, pays his dues and serves the public.

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

Oh, I don't know, perhaps thirty years around bikers, both "traditional" and Blue Knights. She can spot a phony at twenty paces.

Ah, so she's a biker. You too I suppose?

You wouldn't mind then if we started applying all the negative biker stereotypes to you two would you? Turn about is fair play right?

But here's the thrust of argument. Mall guards are not the police.

No they aren't, and they don't do the same job. It was rightly pointed out that police have no obligation to protect you. Security just might. Read the contract, it's in the details. A property owner does have an obligation to provide reasonable protection for the persons on their property. Security operate with the full authority, and responsibilities of the property owner. So yes, in a legal sense, in court, it can be argued that Security officers have the obligation to protect you to a reasonable extent... unless they are only contracted to protect property and not the persons there in.

They don't do the same training.

You are right again. My officers have better training than the local police department does.

They don't have the same privileges under law.

Sometimes we have better privileges under the law. Citizens are not restricted in the same way by your constitutional rights that the government (police) are.

In fact, I doubt that any of them have ever cracked a law book or bothered to go to any seminars.

I require all of my officers to attend the Criminal Justice associates program at the local community college, which is probably more formal legal education than most line LEOs these days since I have never seen a hiring requirement that specifies actual legal orientated education. Heck, some of the local PD's hire with High School Diploma, or with Diploma +x hours of unspecified college education. It's somewhat rare around here to see an actual degree requirement.

As a previous posters points out, they hang around and talk to the real police.

So? We hang around and talk to a lot of people. A lot of the officers on the local force happen to be our friends. Should we not be their friends now that we wear different uniforms, if we wear a uniform at all? Get over it.

The schmooze, they use "cop jargon" ...

Oh noes, not the cop jargon! You would think industry standardized vocabulary would be a good thing.

If law enforcement is your desire, then go to class at your local college or join the army.

Did both. LEO and Army that is. My officers make more money than the local PD now.

PPOs, we're in demand.

Just don't give us that "thin blue line" hokus-pokus and relate war stories.

You have a real serious chip on your shoulder against security officers don't you?

There has got to be something to this... Perhaps on bagging on security officers in general, you could tell us the story of the crappy officer that ruined it for you.

he would come home at nite take a shower and where is gun belt over his bathrobe.

That's just... ... wrong.

 

[Poper]

Originally Posted by cassandrasdaddy
he would come home at nite take a shower and where is gun belt over his bathrobe.

I USED to do this, but the caps would get wet and wouldn't go 'bang'. Had to give it up. Besides, the pin on my plastic sheriff's badge rusted off....

That's just... ... wrong.

You're right!


Poper

 

[davepool]

Two years ago the company i work for experienced several burglaries and thefts of construction equipment so we hired a private security firm to watch the place at night. It was winter so we allowed the guards to use the superintendents office to stay warm between patrols of the yard. I'm the service manager and am on call 24/7 for emergencies.One morning at about 2:00 AM i got the call for a collapsed roof on one of our jobs and had to go out to the job site, I stopped by the office to get my camera and when i walked in,i caught the guard having sex with his "friend" on my desk. I will never forget the look on these two guys faces when i walked in and literally caught them with their pants down....worst of all the ,um, "pitcher" had his gunbelt on....try to get that picture out your head!

 

[R127]

Wow! I usually have no intrest in these kinds of threads but I checked this one out of curiosity. All I can say is it really shows you who has been drinking the koolaid.

 

[The Tourist]

ClickClickD'oh, I will pass on some wisdom that guys learn over time.

First, if you are not who you say you are, nothing I can add will matter. Second, if you are who you say you are, no explanation is needed.

I looked at how much bandwidth you chewed up, and all you proved is what I already told you. That being I dislike chest-thumpers, but I admire veterans.

That's not hard to grasp, is it?

 

[2Lman]

Thanks, Davepool...

Now I can't get that picture out of my mind...

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

First, if you are not who you say you are, nothing I can add will matter. Second, if you are who you say you are, no explanation is needed.

I am what I say I am, it's a public records search in my state so feel free to have at it.

And yes, some explanation is needed, since to me it appears that you seagulled into this thread and went after a profession that you appear to know next to nothing about based solely on the flawed perception you have garnered from observing a mall officer or two during your life.

As I asked before, should I base my perception of bikers on the few drunk A-holes I've arrested during my time. Honestly, I'd prefer the guys who go on the charity rides myself.

I looked at how much bandwidth you chewed up, and all you proved is what I already told you.

That's funny, because from where I'm sitting it looks like I countered everything you said, not proved it.

It look to me like you threw a bunch of garbage against the wall to see what sticks and a real Leo/Veteran/Security Officer walked by and made you clean it up.

That being I dislike chest-thumpers, but I admire veterans.

The Security Officers at the mall that you disdain, which are they? Have you spent enough time around them to know? Okay, you saw them talking to a Police Officer once. So? Were they conducting buisness? Were they friends? Did the Police Officer initiate the contact? Were they working together in a co-operative operation?

My guys have had details that have taken them into malls in hard uniform before. How would you know the differance between them and any other security officer, who apparently due to thier being assigned to a mall makes them beneath you?

 

[The Tourist]

ClickClickD'oh, you are certainly the type of debater people ultimately hate. Paste and copy. Paste and copy.

My feeling is that your concern for the argument actually goes the other way. Meaning, you don't really believe that the crux of my argument is that I have disdain for the tacticool, rather, I think your got rattled by a biker. Big time. Someone on a Harley really scared you silly.

This debate has been going on for several pages--basically all on the same slant. Then you find out I'm a biker, and here's your chance.

You can safely insult and deride a group that you don't have the guts to challenge in real life. Which is kind of the topic here to begin with.

Here's the dirty little secret. Yeah, the biker probably sent warm pee down your leg. But let's be real. Bikers fight equals. There's not much glory in jamming the tacticool head first into their "patrol Prius." Relax. No one cares.

 

[MakAttak]

You can safely insult and deride a group that you don't have the guts to challenge in real life. Which is kind of the topic here to begin with.

Here's the dirty little secret. Yeah, the biker probably sent warm pee down your leg. But let's be real. Bikers fight equals. There's not much glory in jamming the tacticool head first into their "patrol Prius." Relax. No one cares.

I have no dog in this fight. (Also note, I'm a horrible copy and paster) However, to make that argument after ridiculing private security seems rather hypocritical.

 

[R127]

*glug glug glug*

 

[The Tourist]

However, to make that argument after ridiculing private security seems rather hypocritical.

I hate to sound mundane, but he's the one that won't let it go.

I simply have seen the type before. He was probably doing something like showing off for a girl on how "bikers ain't so tough," a guy heard him. Called him out. Embarrassed him.

My point is that he should forget it. The biker that caused him this distress forgot who he was ten minutes later.

But back to the debate--we're no singling out any one particular mall ninja. The crux of the discussion here is that no one is being fooled, and more professionalism should be attained. That's all.

If you'll notice, real mall guards have underlined the issue that this type of strutting tacticool poser exists. In the end, this type provide no real security nor they seem to have a real grasp of the law other than the Waler Mitty view they have of themselves.

Persoanlly, my wife shops at these places, and eats in those food courts. She would obtain better safety and security from real police and Vegas style cameras.

 

[R127]

*glug glug glug glug glug*

This thread just gets better and better! I'm going to have to read these more often.

 

[The Tourist]

This thread just gets better and better!

Then I'm about to bore you to tears.

One of the things older folks should do is to help correct stereotypes. For example, in gun forums we all too quickly tell "knife to a gunfight" jokes, and younger guys hear that. The problem, of course, is reality. Anyone who makes a joke like that in a serious discussion should google Snopes and look at some real knife wounds.

Same here. We have discussed the things we like, and dislike, about mall security. In doing that, ClickClickD'oh showed us a parallel fear/dislike he has for bikers. Now, that's something I can remedy.

If we were in the same room, I would tell him to go to a Harley shop on a Saturday afternoon and actually meet some folks. Go ask a biker why he modified his bike. Perhaps I might also suggest he go to the Harley home page and view the video "Live By It." My point is that something has got him on the wrong track.

Back to our debate. Perhaps we did ridicule the profession, but my concern still stands. At the core, there is a safety issue. It is not being solved. More of the same fools no one. Jamming a 20 year old in kevlar insults my intelligence. Does your wife ever go to these places alone? How do you feel?

 

[Spyvie]

"bikers ain't so tough," a guy heard him. Called him out. Embarrassed him.

Bikers ain't so tough.

What exactly is a biker? Isn't it a love for a lifestyle based on an attitude and a manor of dress. Or is it the careful maintenance of an image of intimidation based on that style of dress (a style shared with both some genuine criminals and at least one member of the village people) Or is really about the love for the machine... little more than an expensive replica of an antique motorcycle. Or perhaps it's just an affinity for the “show your tits” mentality, with lots of drunken brawls and oil spots in the driveway.

Unless they make their living running illegal drugs or weapons, all bikers are the original posers.

 

[The Tourist]

What exactly is a biker? Isn't it a love for a lifestyle based on an attitude and a manor of dress.

Obviously, you don't know any.

I've been around them boy and man since the mid 1960's. Yes, there are outlaws, and I have two or three friends from that old lifestyle.

However, bikers can also be Blue Knights, and I know them, as well.

That's not my point here. Writer Hunter Thompson aptly described dislike for something as "fear and loathing." That concept I run into all of the time.

For example, a guy who yells 'poser' is a guy that doesn't have the physical strength to get a Harley off the kick-stand. So he belittles the entire group.

ClickClickD'oh has some real hatred, and that shows me someone really threw fear into him during a very personal confrontation. He loathes us, and that's because he fears us.

In truth, it's not correct in either example. I don't spend a whole bunch of time even thinking about it. How serious do you think I actually take it when I'm sitting on a Harley and some citizen yells that on foot--on a sidewalk?

If I'm out riding, I'm enjoying the day, having fun with other friends. It's usually the townies and the bubbas that start the problem.

So I offered him some sincere advice as a patch-holder and a guy who has seen this type of stuff before. He got scared by one biker. Come and meet the rest of us.

You will also notice during the debate that I have respect for veterans and real cops. I try to live as I preach.

 

[Spyvie]

Discretion is the better part of valor here.

Suffice to say that as an avid motorcycle enthusiast my experience with “bikers” has not been altogether positive.

 

[The Tourist]

Suffice to say that as an avid motorcycle enthusiast my experience with “bikers” has not been altogether positive.

You have to meet some different folks.

Right now, today, you could ride into the parking lot of my club without fear. In fact, if you had some mechanical problem, or just ran out of food money, I'm sure the members would get you back onto the highway.

It's like I've said wasting bandwidth, something got you off of the trolley.

I've had the privilege of going to Sturgis twice. I've ridden all over Wisconsin as a patch-holder and as a tourist and never met a biker I couldn't talk to.

That's why I joined the debate here. I've met more Walter Mitty jerks than real deal bikers. That encompasses 40 years...

Go to a Harley shop. Meet some decent people.