Best rifle for defensive butt-stroking?

[Tarvis]

especially ARs seem ridiculous for this.

What about the AR makes it ridiculous? If it's the integrity of the stock, remember the rifle is modular, put on an A2 stock and load it with a lead weight if you're ambitious enough.

If you are referring to the integrity of the lower receiver where the buffer tube screws in, you may have a point, but I'm willing to bet no one has done any real testing on the lower's integrity in that sense.

If you smack someone with an AR you have a reaaaaal high probability of fracturing the butt and/or buggering up your recoil buffer tube.......Not a good thing, weapon out for the count.

Maybe with a collapsible stock, but you'd have to hit someone really hard to bend that tube. You might be able to chip off a piece of the el-cheapo collapsible stocks, but the CTR's are pretty tough. I doubt you could hit someone hard enough to make a stock malfunction.

I think I go with a anything in 50 BMG just because all most anything that shoots that round is over 25 pounds.

They make AR conversions. Also, weight is good and all, but you'd be better off with a balanced rifle than you would with a heavy one.

 

[foghornl]

Would not really want to butt-stroke anyone with my Marlin .30/30

However; a smackdown delivered via the M1 Garand, SKS or M-44 Mosin.....

 

[gvnwst]

there is a reason that my AR's buttstock is called "clubfoot"

Just kidding.

Really, AK or mosin!

 

[RP88]

for modern guns, definitely your AK. Hard, solid gun with a hard, solid buttplate. Get hit by it and it's all over. I personally wouldnt want to use an AR. As said before, the AR makes a good whiffle bat

 

[lions]

Also, weight is good and all, but you'd be better off with a balanced rifle than you would with a heavy one.

I'm with Tarvis on this one.

A heavy rifle does make a great club but isn't great for executing follow up movements. In basic training with the pugil sticks we were taught a series of strikes, such as: parry right, thrust, butt-stroke, butt-smash, slash. With each movement leaving you in position for the next. I feel like I could accomplish that better with something along the lines of an AK.

AKs and especially ARs seem ridiculous for this.

I agree the AR isn't ideal because of the recoil buffer tube in the stock but I don't see any drawbacks of using the AK. I would vote AK for the best.

 

[tribbles]

Seriously, I think that any given Mosin or Mauser would be an excellent butt-stroking implement.

 

[Slamfire]

Japanese Arisaka.

The Japanese were very serious about hand to hand combat. They practiced live bayonet practice. If you look, you will find the pictures.

The Arisaksa rifle had reinforcement straps on the pistol grip, top and bottom. These straps were thick heavy steel, and they were there to prevent the stock from shattering during butt strokes.

The nose cap of the Arisaka also had tangs, to keep the foreend together when the bayonet was used.

I understand from a Special Services friend, that the Garand stock held together during buttstroke practice, but that a wooden M14 stock often shattered.

 

[22lr]

Id say Garand, a good tough rifle that is heavy enough to believe a nice blow but balanced enough as well. Heck they made it though Normandy, Iwo Jima.....thats all the proof I need that its a tough as heck rifle.

 

[rbernie]

If you smack someone with an AR you have a reaaaaal high probability of fracturing the butt and/or buggering up your recoil buffer tube.......Not a good thing, weapon out for the count.

If I smack somebody with the butt of an AR, it's because it's out of ammo or otherwise no longer a useful rifle. At that point, I really don't think that I care too much if I damage the buffer tube.

 

[MT GUNNY]

B.A.R.

 

[MT GUNNY]

All joking aside!


For those who remember Basic training. Ive seen hundreds of soldiers Butt stroking dummies and stabbing with bayonets. In every instance Ive never seen a M16A2 stock Break.. If it was a problem I'm shure the military wouldn't have adopted them

 

[woodybrighton]

the L85 barrel jab was surprisingly effective aggresion beats a baseball bat anyday

 

[MAKster]

There was a post a while ago were a guy was fooling around and hit some drywall with a Benelli Nova and the butt broke off.

 

[Float Pilot]

Any Swede Mauser 94, 96 of M-38. The M/38 having the best length for bayonet and butt attack.

Swede AG-42. They are pretty darn tough.

Any M/98 Mauser variant.

Any 1903 or 1903A3 Springfield. (The C stock would be nice.)

P-14 or 1917 Enfield. (Heavy bone basher)

M-1 Garand.

Fiberglassed stocked M-14, although the hinged floorplate could cause problems.

FN-49. Talk about heavy duty....

A good solid FN- FAL

The G-3s with the old original solid fixed stocks would work OK.

 

[scythefwd]

In basic, I hit the dummies with everything I had with my M16. The dummies were the hard plastic claymore targets (very hard). The dummy stopped me full swing with everything I had, and the stock showed now wear at all. A military style AR stock is sufficient to take a good but stroke. I'd rather have my garand though.

 

[_N4Z_]

I was taught the butt stroke with the M16A1.


But I am going to vote Mosin. M44 or 38 CQB, any other variation for on the open field.

 

[benEzra]

AKs and especially ARs seem ridiculous for this.

The AK was DESIGNED to be strong enough for use as an impact weapon. Remember, this was only a few years after Stalingrad.

In fact, Eastern European AK folding stocks are strong enough to use as impact weapons. (Although Western aftermarket stocks probably aren't.) And you can drive nails with AK magazines.

Sonny Puzikas (former Spetsnaz) has a video out showing some interesting hand-to-hand methods of wielding the AK, using not just the butt but also the front sight post and the slant brake for strikes. I assume some of this was meant for crowd control, as a lot of the front-sight techniques are takedowns (not particularly practical for civilians, but interesting to watch).

 

[Avenger]

Having actually tried it (into an old punching bag), I can say that the 91/30 is a GREAT bayonet platform. And it would make a good club too, it balances right under the trigger group, which means most of weight is at the butt end.

Hmmm, I just thought of something.....I wonder how well a 91/30 would do as a SPEAR?!?!

 

[Brian Williams]

Any more talk about (as my Drill instructor aptly said) packing peanut butter and you will find yourself out the door.

 

[Gord]

I wonder how well a 91/30 would do as a SPEAR?

Pretty much my reason for choosing it here. Given the choice (and assuming I weren't in the middle of a seething mass of zombies, or something) I'd rather have the extra reach and simply kebab someone from five feet away than get down and dirty with a buttstock at contact distance. If it did come to that, I'm sure it'd be too long and butt-heavy to grab by the barrel and use as an actual club for any length of time, but it occurs to me that it'd make a very effective "double lightsaber" deal keeping a normal grip on the gun. Buttstrokes with the buttstock, jabs and whacks with the barrel...

 

[Dienekes]

Tried it once for real with a M94 .30-30 carbine. Slight error in timing (let the guy get a little too close) and contact was made with the muzzle and front sight. I was trying to connect with the curved steel buttplate at the time. Slight error in technique aside, it was enough to bust his jaw.

Always have been fond of that little Winchester ever since...

The Garand would be the club of choice, though.

 

[rbernie]

but it occurs to me that it'd make a very effective "double lightsaber" deal keeping a normal grip on the gun. Buttstrokes with the buttstock, jabs and whacks with the barrel...

This was the technique we were taught in Basic. You shifted the strong hand from the pistol grip to the base of the stock just above the grip, and used both ends of the rifle to good effect.

 

[rangerruck]

Mosin.

 

[HM2PAC]

Any of my MilSurp's would do.

Now that I've replaced the stock on my PTR with wood, it would do OK as well.

 

[Hutch]

Garand. One lick on the grape, and they'll be getting coloring books for Christmas for the rest of their lives. <wish I could remember where I read that...>