Teachers in Texas schools are already armed / School Marshals

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Two and/or separate options and in both cases identities of school staff carrying or marshals are hidden:

1. Voluntary Concealed Carry - School staff conceal carry all the time
2. School Marshal Program - Part-time marshals with guns locked up


1. Voluntary Concealed Carry:

2/22/18 Los Angeles Times - As gun debate roils on, teachers in this Texas school are already armed - http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-texas-school-armed-20180222-story.html

At Argyle High School, there is a sign posted that states, "Please be aware that the staff at Argyle are armed and may use whatever force is necessary to protect our students."

School board decided to allow staff to be armed after the Sandy Hook Elementary School massacre in 2012.

After the school shooting in Florida, more staff at Argyle High School volunteered to carry guns.

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2. School Marshal Program:

2/24/18 Politico - How Texas is a model for Trump's gun-toting teachers - The state created a program to intensively train and arm "school marshals." Its creator thinks it could well be the inspiration for the president's endorsement of arming educators - https://www.politico.com/story/2018/02/24/armed-teachers-texas-trump-362397

Texas created a program to train and arm school staff to become "school marshals":
  • Must pass background check
  • Participants go through active-shooter training
  • Guns are kept in a lockbox
  • Can only use frangible ammunition
  • They are deputized only in active shooting situation
 
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Good thought! But guns not on a person? In a locked box? Useless! Your personally owned pistol, concealed, the way to go. Imagine, open box, if you can obtain the key, has the pistol a full magazine inserted, you now need to operate the slide, and jam the gun up. What a silly idea. Treating concealed handgun as an atom bomb!
 
Someone somewhere can find fault in anything under the sun. Is the plan perfect? Not quite (on the surface, anyway). Is it better than nothing? BY FAR.

From the moment they figure out something’s up, they’ll be able to access whatever firearm is in that safe and be ready. Who says it’s a key safe? Biometrics, anyone?

Who knows? Maybe there’s a revolver in there that only requires aim and trigger. And who knows? Maybe teachers are allowed to carry concealed, and the safe is there for a teacher who didnt carry that day.

Would you know enough about this to confidently state that the safe is the ONLY plan? Or are there more legs to this stool that Argyle intentionally left out?

You may not be a teacher in Argyle. And you may or may not have been through the training the teachers have gone through.

Are you familiar enough with Argyle’s plan to criticize it as you have?
 
Old Guy said:
Good thought! But guns not on a person? In a locked box? Useless! Your personally owned pistol, concealed, the way to go. Imagine, open box, if you can obtain the key, has the pistol a full magazine inserted, you now need to operate the slide, and jam the gun up. What a silly idea. Treating concealed handgun as an atom bomb!
Click to expand...

How do you Jam up a revolver??????

In my years of shooting, I've rarely jammed up even a semiauto. If you have jamming issues, change the gun or ammo.
 
It's a step in the right direction, imo.

Incremental progress in the right direction. Embrace it.

After all, incremental progress in the wrong direction has worked for the antis.
 
This type of program is, to my pleasant surprise, much more prevalent in Texas right now than I imagined. Good.
 
Oh....come on! That's impossible! I read that if the teachers are armed that they'll be shooting students left and right....and being more dangerous to themselves and others than the school shooters are. This must be some of that 'fake news' I've been hearing about. NO WAY teachers could be responsible enough to be armed....that's just silly.:) (obvious sarcasm for the dense)
 
In Utah it has be the law for several years that teachers, with a carry permit, may carry while at school. They are required to conceal the firearm.

I see this as a step in the right direction; however, I am a bit critical of the "locked box" idea. It insures that the teacher will leave the firearm unattended as they go about their daily duties. This box is going to create a natural point of interest for the students, seeing if they can open it. I suspect that students would also be more willing to steal a box, than to try to steal the firearm off of a teacher.

I could easily support requiring a holster to have some sort of retention device. However I do not see the locked box as ideal. All that said, as a teacher, I am glad to see them moving in the right direction. I know that if the "locked box" rule were passed where I am, I would go for a box large enough to put a carbine into. After all, if a person has to run to a tool, it should be the right tool.
 
My sister is a retired teacher in Ohio. A few School Districts there have allowed those teachers that want the training can keep a gun in school. None of the teachers know who is armed. Guns are kept in lock boxes in locked desks.
 
And I know a few UT teachers who carry to school everyday (public schools, private schools can ban weapons), two are ex-marines, the others are just those with a Ut permit. However, the UT permit does not require any training, other than a ludicrous short training class. The ones I know who carry do have extensive training on their own time. I believe since UT enacted their concealed carry law, it has been legal for anyone with a UT permit to carry into a public school. That includes students in college; public ok, but private is up to the school.
 
it appears to me they don’t give out all the details. The article suggests the safes are not publicized. Meaning the students do not know where the boxes are, or even if there are boxes in student-accessible areas.

They may be in a teacher’s lounge, or other place where students are not.

They also aren’t publicizing what’s in them. There could be a shotgun, for all anybody knows. The marshals ain’t talkin.

Again, is the plan perfect? Maybe, or maybe not. But it’s a plan. And a workable one. Better than in a lot of other places.
 
Old Guy said:
Good thought! But guns not on a person? In a locked box? Useless! Your personally owned pistol, concealed, the way to go.
Click to expand...
These are two separate programs.

One is voluntary concealed carry all the time and the other is a school marshal program where guns are locked up and marshals access them during active shooter situation only. In both cases, identities of school staff are hidden.

It would be nice if school staff had access to body armor.

I revised the OP and added:
Two and/or separate options and in both cases identities of school staff carrying or marshals are hidden:

1. Voluntary Concealed Carry - School staff conceal carry all the time
2. School Marshal Program - Part-time marshals with guns locked up
Click to expand...
 
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It would be nice if school staff had access to body armor.
Click to expand...

It would be nicer if the causes of these incidents were addressed so there was no need for body armor.
 
But the reality is we have school shootings and chances are we will continue having school shootings.

This is "doing something" as various things done after Sandy Hook shooting haven't worked to stop the shooter during school shooting as we recently saw with Florida shooting.

Armed school staff shooting back at the active shooter is "doing something" that will more likely stop the killing of children.

If these courageous staff want to protect children, then I say help them by providing body armor.
 
<-----Texas schoolteacher

If the Texas legislature really wanted teachers to be able to protect out students they wouldn't have implemented the School Marshal program or given each local school board the right to dictate which teachers can carry.

All Texas teachers really want is the right to carry firearms where the bad guys do. And current Texas law on concealed or open carry does not allow that.
 
dogtown tom said:
<-----Texas schoolteacher

If the Texas legislature really wanted teachers to be able to protect out students they wouldn't have implemented the School Marshal program or given each local school board the right to dictate which teachers can carry.

All Texas teachers really want is the right to carry firearms where the bad guys do. And current Texas law on concealed or open carry does not allow that.
Click to expand...

Agreed, what is being described here is unlikely to work well, Locking the firearms in the office does not provide teachers access to firearms during an emergency.

This looks like a bill carefully crafted to show that "arming teachers" does no good. If the teacher is really expected to sprint from their classroom, leaving their students behind, get a handgun from the office, then start to actively seek the shooter, then it a terrible plan. Normally one can say that any plan is better than no plan; but this may be a case where no plan at all is a better idea. If they really expect teachers do what I just described then it may well be worse than the current situation of leaving everyone unarmed. If what I described really is the plan then it is clearly a plan that will show that arming teaches does no good.

If that isn't the plan, and the plan is to have a locked locker in the classroom, it is a better plan. It still disarms the teacher when they are not in the classroom; and it leaves students able to try to open the locker when the teacher is absent. However, if the room is locked with the teacher in it, with the students, it does, assuming there is enough time, the teacher to retrieve their firearm, load it, and insure that no one enters the room.

In summary, firearms locked in the office may be worse than no firearms. Locked in the room is better than nothing; but not ideal.
 
I dont think that’s what your quoted poster was referring to. I believe he was arguing that the state should allow CC by teachers on a state level as opposed to leaving it up to districts or local school boards.
 
If our schools have become so dangerous that we need to arm the teachers then perhaps we need to keep our children home. No active shooters, drugs, or liberal indoctrination there.
 
My wife and daughter both work at "Gun Free Zones" I much prefer the Argyle school option with the sign they have posted. Does not make you safe but gives a person a fighting chance - as it is now, they have no chance.
 
Ohio has a teacher/staff training program, sponsored by the Buckeye Firearms Association, with the acronym FASTER. Colorado has a similar program.
 
I have lived in Texas since 1971 and knew we had schools that had armed teachers, school administrators or other for several years. Not sure when the first was but I first heard about it right after Sandy Hook. There may be some schools that have programs and not made a lot of noise about it.

I would be surprised that any school that does any program like this doesn't do it in coordination with local PD and Sheriff dept. with training together and drills. That way they know each other and know at least a little what to expect from the other.

concealed carry or in a lock box or cabinet in the classroom and or administrators office should be left up to those in the program. If locked up I am thinking a pistol caliber carbine would be much better than a handgun but again that should be left up to the person in the program. School administrator who keeps it in a cabinet in his office should have both a carbine and handgun in retention holster that share the same magazines.

While I am all for this for those willing to participate what we are talking about is a last line of defense after all other lines of defense have failed as they did in Florida.

None of this should diminish strengthening the lines of defense before this last line if indeed they need to be strengthened.

These programs mighty also heighten the awareness of teachers, police and maybe others close to the program that might make a difference before it turns into a school shooting.
 
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If it's not on their person they might as well not be doing it.

I agree it could be perceived as the idea not working should there ever be a need for them.
 
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