never_retreat
Member
e-mail sent
Lets turn this in to a legitimate mail bomb.
Lets turn this in to a legitimate mail bomb.
Zumboing David Petzal
- Thread starter taliv
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Does anyone have a copy of his original '94 piece supporting the AWB as proof he's polishing his reputation?
As to the "mental patient" part, I took it as referring to some of the spittle flecked nearly unintelligible rage posts that wouldn't have been permitted here on THR. I not going to cover for the guy, but if we witch hunt someone that actually has a defendable position we'll look like idiots when we could clearly direct that energy at the politicians and possibly gain some ground. We’ve got to have evidence.
There have been threads on THR in the past about what got you into RKBA and so many of them say “I never particularly thought about it until the AWB.” Those folks are some of the most ardent RKBA supporters because they were smacked out of their normal lives by the betrayal of the politicians. Let’s hope that some more can be smacked out of their complacent lives so that AWB + is not only killed but so decimated that the politicians see we’re not asleep at the trigger.
As to the "mental patient" part, I took it as referring to some of the spittle flecked nearly unintelligible rage posts that wouldn't have been permitted here on THR. I not going to cover for the guy, but if we witch hunt someone that actually has a defendable position we'll look like idiots when we could clearly direct that energy at the politicians and possibly gain some ground. We’ve got to have evidence.
There have been threads on THR in the past about what got you into RKBA and so many of them say “I never particularly thought about it until the AWB.” Those folks are some of the most ardent RKBA supporters because they were smacked out of their normal lives by the betrayal of the politicians. Let’s hope that some more can be smacked out of their complacent lives so that AWB + is not only killed but so decimated that the politicians see we’re not asleep at the trigger.
Ian Sean
Member
Petzal is back-peddling!....I been in this fight for almost 20 years now, think I won't remember who the Quillings are?!!!
Link to Petzals blog and latest comments.
http://fieldandstream.blogs.com/gunnut/2007/02/zumbomania_part.html#comment-61354754
Nice to hear I'm a mental patient and a yahoo...
Link to 1994 article...Petzal is quoted about 2/3rds of the way dow (comments on the AWB)
http://www.franksmyth.com/A5584C/clients/franksmyth/frankS2.nsf/ad6eb2ddfbe72a8285256b6c00561193/e45165e76e92dfba85256b7b00790691?OpenDocument
From 1994 article....Petzals words .....
Time to clean house!...
Link to Petzals blog and latest comments.
http://fieldandstream.blogs.com/gunnut/2007/02/zumbomania_part.html#comment-61354754
Nice to hear I'm a mental patient and a yahoo...
Link to 1994 article...Petzal is quoted about 2/3rds of the way dow (comments on the AWB)
http://www.franksmyth.com/A5584C/clients/franksmyth/frankS2.nsf/ad6eb2ddfbe72a8285256b6c00561193/e45165e76e92dfba85256b7b00790691?OpenDocument
From 1994 article....Petzals words .....
Time to clean house!...
Ian Sean
Member
From the blog...
Wonder what type of illegitimate firearms Mr. Petzal is refering to?
Wonder what type of illegitimate firearms Mr. Petzal is refering to?
Meh, that article just seems like an opinion piece to me. He's entitled to it.
There are some irresponsible comments that have been posted about the whole affair. I don't think they are respresentative. However, it's in the nature of a column writer for print media to denigrate new media and raise the value of his own stock. 'The blogs, the chatrooms, the great unedited and unwashed . . .'
For 40 years, Jim has been a spokesman and ambassador of good will for hunting. Through his tireless efforts as a teacher and lecturer on hunting and hunting skills, he has done more for the sport than any 250 of the yahoos who called for his blood.
I'm sure there is truth to that statement. But that's about hunting and not about a right protected by the US Constitution. I'm sorry that hunting is not as available or popular as it once was, but that's population pressure in a highly developed country for you.
To all the chatroom heroes who made him unemployable, I have a word of warning: You’ve been swinging a two-edged sword.
Oh piffle. Jim Zumbo was swinging that sword himself, taking money in sponsorships from companies whose customers he clumsily insulted while calling to bar them from public lands. Shake that stick at somebody else.
I would have been satisfied with a full retraction and a lengthy publication of facts about ARs/AKs by Jim Zumbo. The man could have been useful. If he didn't have the skill to win over readers by the pen he lived by for 40 years, whose fault is that?
jm
There are some irresponsible comments that have been posted about the whole affair. I don't think they are respresentative. However, it's in the nature of a column writer for print media to denigrate new media and raise the value of his own stock. 'The blogs, the chatrooms, the great unedited and unwashed . . .'
For 40 years, Jim has been a spokesman and ambassador of good will for hunting. Through his tireless efforts as a teacher and lecturer on hunting and hunting skills, he has done more for the sport than any 250 of the yahoos who called for his blood.
I'm sure there is truth to that statement. But that's about hunting and not about a right protected by the US Constitution. I'm sorry that hunting is not as available or popular as it once was, but that's population pressure in a highly developed country for you.
To all the chatroom heroes who made him unemployable, I have a word of warning: You’ve been swinging a two-edged sword.
Oh piffle. Jim Zumbo was swinging that sword himself, taking money in sponsorships from companies whose customers he clumsily insulted while calling to bar them from public lands. Shake that stick at somebody else.
I would have been satisfied with a full retraction and a lengthy publication of facts about ARs/AKs by Jim Zumbo. The man could have been useful. If he didn't have the skill to win over readers by the pen he lived by for 40 years, whose fault is that?
jm
Thanks, Ian Sean. That's the type of information I was looking for. Has anyone thrown those in his face on his blog?
Mark Whiteman
Member
That does it. I'm making Soldier of Fortune my hunting magazine from now on.
BullfrogKen
Moderator Emeritus
I took the time to visit ONE, and only one, other site discussing this - Ted Nugent's.
I didn't go to the "other sites", because even on a good day, those places are full of men who act like children, and those who have no manners. They are the equivalent of walking past the corner bar, packed outside with obnoxious, immature men spitting and grabbing their crotch as they boast about things that would make their mothers faint.
He's right, some of those sites are full of obnoxious, rude people. Take the insult if it applies. I'll say it doesn't apply to this community, because we won't permit it. Not the Moderators, but especially the many fine members we have here. When someone posts something out of line, we all get notified. That's a hallmark of the community we've managed to establish here.
That doesn't exist on those other sites. Its the reason I only visit this one. I'll say it again, David is right. Those sites that don't establish community standards for decent behavior are FULL of men who have none, especially now with everyone foaming at the mouth over this issue.
We can get mad, but let's do it honorably. I don't think Petzal deserves to be stomped for commenting on those who are acting the way I've seen on the only other blog I visited.
I didn't go to the "other sites", because even on a good day, those places are full of men who act like children, and those who have no manners. They are the equivalent of walking past the corner bar, packed outside with obnoxious, immature men spitting and grabbing their crotch as they boast about things that would make their mothers faint.
He's right, some of those sites are full of obnoxious, rude people. Take the insult if it applies. I'll say it doesn't apply to this community, because we won't permit it. Not the Moderators, but especially the many fine members we have here. When someone posts something out of line, we all get notified. That's a hallmark of the community we've managed to establish here.
That doesn't exist on those other sites. Its the reason I only visit this one. I'll say it again, David is right. Those sites that don't establish community standards for decent behavior are FULL of men who have none, especially now with everyone foaming at the mouth over this issue.
We can get mad, but let's do it honorably. I don't think Petzal deserves to be stomped for commenting on those who are acting the way I've seen on the only other blog I visited.
Ian Sean
Member
BullfrogKen, this doesn't have anything to do with Zumbo, Petzal himself is a Quisling and now the chickens are coming home to roost.
He made similar if not worse comments in 1994 and stabbed us in the back...and now he is back-peddling to save his rear.
It is nice to know Petzal thinks his M1A is legitimate to own....but not my AK?
Petzal crossed the Rubicon in 1994.
He made similar if not worse comments in 1994 and stabbed us in the back...and now he is back-peddling to save his rear.
It is nice to know Petzal thinks his M1A is legitimate to own....but not my AK?
Petzal crossed the Rubicon in 1994.
doc2rn
Member
The customer service lady gave me the HQ phone # it is 212-779-5286
BullfrogKen
Moderator Emeritus
OK. I don't know what this term Quisling refers to, but it doesn't sound nice.
So, he said something back in 1994, and you're tearing him up over it NOW? You're kidding me, right?
You know, Ronald Reagan supported the Gun Control Act in '86 that banned new manufacture of machine guns. Why don't you go after him, too? Gaston Glock has been known to be strongly opposed to civilian gun ownership. The Germans that make those Sigs and HKs probably had parents in the Nazi party. . .
At some point, this has got to end. I hope it ends before there's no one left to work in the gun industry.
So, he said something back in 1994, and you're tearing him up over it NOW? You're kidding me, right?
You know, Ronald Reagan supported the Gun Control Act in '86 that banned new manufacture of machine guns. Why don't you go after him, too? Gaston Glock has been known to be strongly opposed to civilian gun ownership. The Germans that make those Sigs and HKs probably had parents in the Nazi party. . .
At some point, this has got to end. I hope it ends before there's no one left to work in the gun industry.
carpediem
Member
http://www.house.gov/writerep/
One e-mail politely and reasonably opposing HR 1022 (or any other anti-2A bill) is worth 400 e-mails demanding that Field & Stream fire someone on the basis of what they said 12 years ago. After HR 1022 is defeated then worry about this guy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vidkun_Quisling
One e-mail politely and reasonably opposing HR 1022 (or any other anti-2A bill) is worth 400 e-mails demanding that Field & Stream fire someone on the basis of what they said 12 years ago. After HR 1022 is defeated then worry about this guy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vidkun_Quisling
.38 Special
Member
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2006
- Messages
- 7,355
Yeah, absolutely. Let's add Petzal to the list. He's obviously not marching in lockstep, so we should nail him to the wall, along with his sponsors, his wife, his friends, and anyone who's ever passed him on the street.
So here's my idea: let's boycott every single gunwriter, magazine, arms maker... anyone, really, who has ever had anything to do with the industry. Lord knows they've all done something, said something, thought something or otherwise considered something with which we might disagree. So string 'em up, like any God-fearing, gun-loving, Second Amendment supporting American citizen.
And after we've gang-raped every single aspect of the industry that exists for and because of us, we can all sit around and smugly congratulate ourselves for standing up for our principles.
Gun owners, on the whole, sure can be an irritating lot.
So here's my idea: let's boycott every single gunwriter, magazine, arms maker... anyone, really, who has ever had anything to do with the industry. Lord knows they've all done something, said something, thought something or otherwise considered something with which we might disagree. So string 'em up, like any God-fearing, gun-loving, Second Amendment supporting American citizen.
And after we've gang-raped every single aspect of the industry that exists for and because of us, we can all sit around and smugly congratulate ourselves for standing up for our principles.
Gun owners, on the whole, sure can be an irritating lot.
berettaman
Member
Don't waste your time gentlemen. Asking Time Magazine to fire a man who hates EBR just as much as they do? Yea,that's gonna happen.
At some point, this has got to end. I hope it ends before there's no one left to work in the gun industry.
+1 BFK and all the others. No need to put every hunting and gun writer on the defensive and make them fly the "black rifle" colors.
jm
+1 BFK and all the others. No need to put every hunting and gun writer on the defensive and make them fly the "black rifle" colors.
jm
Ian Sean
Member
Like I said, I have been in this fight for almost 20 years....Petzal made himself a target again by virtue of opening his own big mouth and inserting his foot.
In '94 I ceased doing business or cancelled subscriptions to every mag or company (Ruger for instance...Bill Rugers stance on Hi-cap mags) supporting the AWB.
As boston t party quotes.
"It always happens,
when freedom fails.
The best men rot in filthy jails,
and those who cried
appease, appease,
are hanged by those
they tried to please."
In '94 I ceased doing business or cancelled subscriptions to every mag or company (Ruger for instance...Bill Rugers stance on Hi-cap mags) supporting the AWB.
As boston t party quotes.
"It always happens,
when freedom fails.
The best men rot in filthy jails,
and those who cried
appease, appease,
are hanged by those
they tried to please."
BullfrogKen
Moderator Emeritus
Ian, this is starting to look silly.
You do realize this, don't you?
You do realize this, don't you?
.38 Special
Member
- Joined
- Sep 15, 2006
- Messages
- 7,355
I don't remember the last time I saw so much thoughtless, vindictive kneejerking.
Of yeah. It was the last time we tried to torpedo a part of the gun industry.
The sound you hear in the background is champagne corks popping at HCI headquarters.
Of yeah. It was the last time we tried to torpedo a part of the gun industry.
The sound you hear in the background is champagne corks popping at HCI headquarters.
Ian Sean
Member
I haven't made any "calls to action" just pointing out Petzal's background and history....and my opinion on the matter.
With the change in congress (Here in PA too Ken, lots of new bills in Harrisburg) we have a new and long fight ahead of us once again. Other than the 94 AWB expiring what battles have we won?
Maybe I am getting to tired for this game, but I personally have no patience for those in our own community with a large voice like a Petzal or Zumbo making stupid comments and torpedoing ourselves.
Silly? I don't think so....but we should make sure of who our friends are first, the shooting community has changed (many more EBR owners), and these guys are either ignorant of it or to elitist to care.
With the change in congress (Here in PA too Ken, lots of new bills in Harrisburg) we have a new and long fight ahead of us once again. Other than the 94 AWB expiring what battles have we won?
Maybe I am getting to tired for this game, but I personally have no patience for those in our own community with a large voice like a Petzal or Zumbo making stupid comments and torpedoing ourselves.
Silly? I don't think so....but we should make sure of who our friends are first, the shooting community has changed (many more EBR owners), and these guys are either ignorant of it or to elitist to care.
Kaylee
Member
Hey, someone has to fill that page, whether it be Zumbo, Petzal, or whoever. The magazines want material in order to sell magazines. The sponsors want a place to put their advertising dollars to sell scopes, hunting stuff, ammo, whatever. And the readers want to read witty stuff about guns, hunting, and so forth. So SOMEONE's writing is going to be on that page.
As I see it, there are folks right here on this very board who write hunting or shooting articles better than I've ever seen in a magazine.. Art and Lawdog come to mind right off, and there's plenty more besides. Pax's CCW writings for instance. Tam's snark. Lots of good stuff.
The point is.. there's NO SHORTAGE of people who can write well, know guns, AND aren't willing to throw EBR owners to the wolves in an attempt to appeal to the grabbers.
So if a few careers get ruined now, in the longer scheme, that's just fine with me. They'll be replaced by people who can do the same job, do it well, AND not sell us out. Better yet of course would be a heartfelt mending of their ways, but either way.. we're better off without appeasers in our own ranks.
-K
As I see it, there are folks right here on this very board who write hunting or shooting articles better than I've ever seen in a magazine.. Art and Lawdog come to mind right off, and there's plenty more besides. Pax's CCW writings for instance. Tam's snark. Lots of good stuff.
The point is.. there's NO SHORTAGE of people who can write well, know guns, AND aren't willing to throw EBR owners to the wolves in an attempt to appeal to the grabbers.
So if a few careers get ruined now, in the longer scheme, that's just fine with me. They'll be replaced by people who can do the same job, do it well, AND not sell us out. Better yet of course would be a heartfelt mending of their ways, but either way.. we're better off without appeasers in our own ranks.
-K
QuestionEverything
Member
- Joined
- Sep 13, 2006
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- 178
This dude's not part of the gun industry. He's part of the hunting-related media, and he's trying to propagate the idea that "respectable" hunters should distance themselves from EBRs. If he wants to follow Zumbo into the hopper, he's free to do it. If Field and Stream gets smacked down and pressured into supporting the RKBA along with Outdoor Life, that'll be one less pro-AWB voice.
BullfrogKen
Moderator Emeritus
Ian, I am quite aware of what goes on in Harrisburg. I live only 15 minutes away from the "south bridge" of the city.
Which is why I don't care what these gun writers do. I never have, never will. I care about what my lawmakers do.
Yes, calling someone to task for something they said over a decade ago is silly. The industry GOT THE POINT. If you can't find anything more recent, like him saying we should preserve the ban rather than let it expire, I think we need to let it go. The time for action was then, not now. You're a little late.
He's not a lawmaker. He's not even a "news reporter". He's writing for a recreational magazine, for people who don't want their hunting articles mucked up with shrill gun rights talk. The subscribers to those magazines like that format. My father-in-law likes that format. I have different views, but we manage to find common ground.
What have we gained? Expanded CCW laws. If you would have told me 15 years ago we'd see so many states with shall issue laws, I'd say you were crazy. That is an accomplishment you might take for granted, since PA has had it for generations now. But it is a huge gain.
Either you can continue to castigate every member of our industry that doesn't see things your way, or you can take that anger and focus it on the true enemy. The industry got the message.
Which is why I don't care what these gun writers do. I never have, never will. I care about what my lawmakers do.
Yes, calling someone to task for something they said over a decade ago is silly. The industry GOT THE POINT. If you can't find anything more recent, like him saying we should preserve the ban rather than let it expire, I think we need to let it go. The time for action was then, not now. You're a little late.
He's not a lawmaker. He's not even a "news reporter". He's writing for a recreational magazine, for people who don't want their hunting articles mucked up with shrill gun rights talk. The subscribers to those magazines like that format. My father-in-law likes that format. I have different views, but we manage to find common ground.
What have we gained? Expanded CCW laws. If you would have told me 15 years ago we'd see so many states with shall issue laws, I'd say you were crazy. That is an accomplishment you might take for granted, since PA has had it for generations now. But it is a huge gain.
Either you can continue to castigate every member of our industry that doesn't see things your way, or you can take that anger and focus it on the true enemy. The industry got the message.
MudPuppy
Member
Agree completely with Kaylee--thank you for expressing it so eloquently.
The term bad apples comes to mind.
The term bad apples comes to mind.
Prince Yamato
Member
I don't hunt. So he hasn't done squat for me.
ReadyontheRight
Member
Hear hear. Zumbo's supposed "40 years of supporting hunting" doesn't do much for me when he says I don't belong in his "hunting fraternity" because I shoot a "terrorost rifle".
Quisling is an excellent description of these folks who pretend to be for the second amendment, while calling for infringements on the right to keep and bear arms because of the way they look. It's a lot easier to lose a war when those supposedly on our side are making maps and holding doors open for the enemy.
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