223 for deer update

[H&Hhunter]

Severe entry angles will cause bullets to do strange things sometimes.

 

[d2wing]

To clarify a little more. The way FMJ and soft point bullets work is not the same.
A soft point bullet is designed to expand in the animals vitals. Deer are pretty thin broadside. A bullet designed for penetration will pass through and do little damage. A varmit bullet can come apart without enough penetration, especially at a quarter angle. A bullet always does the most damage to soft tissue when it expands. That is the main way how transfer of energy occurs. At least with high speed expanding bullets. Low speed and FMJ bullets work a little differently.
I have always had good luck with broad side shots with 55 gr PSP bullets but others will work. The .223 does limit the shot angles and range.
You don't have to worry much about any of that with a 30-06 with hunting bullets. The reason I used an AR was a severe shoulder injury. I have since got a 7-08 in a bolt action. It suits me pretty well and in my opinion is a better rig.
I have said many times that bigger and faster is better but if you know what you are doing you can make just about anything work. Much of our wild game was wiped out in the black powder days.

 

[jim in Anchorage]

Jim,

The round I use is a Federal Premium 165 grain Nosier Partition. I have used this round for several years and killed quite a few deer with it and never had an issue so I don't know why this particular animal was different. It was a shot I am comfortable making, especially at that distance, and I have dropped several bucks within ten yards of this spot as they always have scrapes and rubs in the area. He was working a scrape when I shot him. The entry wound was exactly where I expected but the bullet did not continue straight into the vitals rather it appeared to be deflected downward. The hair at the spot was white and it was a severe gut shot.

Well odd things do happen. Apparently the bullet hit the ribs at just the right angle to deflect. But boy that was bad luck. I have been using a 180 Nosier partion in a 30-06 for ever on moose and caribou and it's money in the bank.

 

[Traffer]

Head shot

If I was forced to use a 223 for deer, I would go for head shots. Just that simple.

 

[ironworkerwill]

Nothing is 100%. The brain and heart are comparable in size. The vital zone, broad side, is fairly large being several times larger than the brain.

Botched head shots have crippled or starved many deer to death.

 

[jim in Anchorage]

Nothing is 100%. The brain and heart are comparable in size. The vital zone, broad side, is fairly large being several times larger than the brain.

Botched head shots have crippled or starved many deer to death.

True. I have seen deer with there lower jaws shot off. Can't imagine doing a more horrible thing to a animal. Quit playing GI Joe with your AR15's and shoot a gun that can break bones.

 

[stiab]

The entry wound was exactly where I expected but the bullet did not continue straight into the vitals rather it appeared to be deflected downward.

I noticed the same thing several years ago, i.e. that the path of the bullet once it entered the deer did not always continue on the same line based upon the path of bullet before hitting. This was true for .243 and .30-06. It never caused me to loose a deer, but was obvious while cleaning it, and some path changes were even at right angles!.

I asked two old time deer hunters from PA about this, and they said it was because I was using "pointed bullets". They use only round nose bullets, so I switched from the 150 pointed to 180 round in .30-06 and it has never happened again.

 

[H&Hhunter]

Quit playing GI Joe with your AR15's and shoot a gun that can break bones.

I absolutely agree. If you want to use an AR platform for hunting get an AR-10. I just played with a new Smith & Wesson M&P-10 that weighs 7.7 lbs and shoots .5 MOA out of the box. All of the AR cool factor, very limited recoil, accurate and as light or lighter than many AR-15's on the market. And it shots a no kidding big game capable .308 with any kind of hunting bullets you want to use. If I was going to choose to hunt big game with an AR that would be my rig, no two ways about it.

 

[jim in Anchorage]

I absolutely agree. If you want to use an AR platform for hunting get an AR-10. I just played with a new Smith & Wesson M&P-10 that weighs 7.7 lbs and shoots .5 MOA out of the box. All of the AR cool factor, very limited recoil, accurate and as light or lighter than many AR-15's on the market. And it shots a no kidding big game capable .308 with any kind of hunting bullets you want to use. If I was going to choose to hunt big game with an AR that would be my rig, no two ways about it.

Looks like you're not the only one getting .5 MOA out of a M&P 10. I agree 100% with you if you want a AR for BG get a M&P 10. Why fool around with popguns when you can shoot a .308.
Good report here-http://gunblast.com/SW-MP10.htm

 

[AKElroy]

I've climbed in to the AR game for the first time this year, and I have to say I am loving the platform. The accuracy and shootability are very confidence inspiring, so I definitely see why folks want to use it for their hunting needs. I just got in a case of M262, and I am going to try it out on piggies soon. Being paper-punchers, the Sierra Match-Kings are thin enough to expand (even fragment), yet at 77 grains still carry some decent weight and penetration for this caliber. If the pigs fall readily, I will consider using it for deer. The whitetail around here never run over 150lbs, usually more like 100.