Mobil 1 Synthetic

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Lubrication is the easy part, IMO.

I'd like to see a corrosion protection comparison between Mobil 1, Breakfree CLP and EEZOX. Something like a salt-spray exposure test.

And given that I sometimes take advantage of the "C" (cleaning) properties of CLP, it would be interesting to see how Mobil 1 stacks up as a general gun-cleaning solvent.
 
I work for a competitor to EM (ExxonMobil) but I use Mobil 1 on my guns. I talked to our lubrication's engineers one time on the corporate jet and the basic comment was it would be fine for guns, no real issue there, but it is not a corrosion protection lube. Use something else to protect from rust.

I have had no problems with it and I am still on my first bottle.

I think back and I am sure some of you all are like me and remember using 3 in 1 oil, motor oil out of the car block, 10w30 or 30wt, when we were rich hoppes oil or even sewing machine oil. 30 years ago or more we did not have all of these super oils and most of my guns are more like 70 years old and they are just fine with no rust.

My conclusion is that care and dedication to cleaning and maintaining your toys are far more important then the oil you use to do it because 70 years ago, CLP or (insert your favorite wizard oil here) did not exist.
 
I've switched and have been using Mobil 1 15W50 on my firearms. No problems yet!! I've used it with such good success in my LT1 Z28 and my wife's car for years now, I think it should work fine.
 
JohnKSa:

I have done several informal salt spray tests which included Mobile 1, CLP and Eezox.

Eezox came out way ahead. It showed no corrosion on freshly bead blasted steel bar stock after 5 days of being sprayed 3 times a day.

CLP lasted about 2 days before showing some speckles.

Mobile 1 was showing speckles within 24 hrs and was well corroded by the end of day 2.

Control (bare) showed corrosion within about 3 hrs and at the end of two days looked like it had been in the ocean.

One of the main problems with most oils as corrosion inhibitors is they are lighter than water and float off the surface. Eezox is 1.3 times heavier than water and doesn't float off.
 
GunSlinger
Thank you for your post. I have found this thread very useful and informative. I just figured you were goofy for motor oils :D and I'm glad you are! The information, and your expertise are well appreciated. I've actually been wondering about lubrication and firearms. I will now be using Mobil1 in all of my firearms!
 
Peter & DBR,

Thanks for the information, that's kind of what I expected. DBR's results were interesting--I wasn't sure of the quantitative difference.

As mentioned, I also find the "C" function of CLP useful from time to time. The convenience of being able to carry one small bottle in my "emergency" kit is worth the few extra bucks I spend on a specialty lube.
 
BigBlock,

I had initially used the gear lube too, but found that it began to smell strongly when it was heated up during long strings of fire. It'll do the job if you don't mind the odor though.


LotI,

The 20W50 (VTWIN) is what I most prefer and use on my guns. I have not been able to determine its ZDDP content, but my 'educated' quess is that there is probably plenty. It seems to be a prevalent additive in high performance oils and the 20W50 certainly qualifies due to its intended usage.


DBR,

Good question.

The Redline will probably do just fine in most applications on your AR as the oil itself forms a physical barrier to oxygen upon the surface of the metal of any firearm that it would be used upon. In most instances pending immediate cleaning, I would say that you probably have very little to worry about in terms of oxidation. However, when considering a gas operation system like the AR that utilizes direct gas impingement and its tendency to carbonize lubricants in addition to the fact that the Eezox remains not only present, but is also easier to clean, my inclination would be to go with what works and stick with the Eezox. Let's face it: Easiest is best. :) It would appear that Eezox performed well in your informal tests, too.

My guns are either all stainless (Tikka T3's) or are Glocks and H&K's and are pretty corrosion resistant in their own right without protectants. I would say that with normal care and diligence, I'll most liklely never have a problem, but others may have different guns and finishes and of course......YMMV. Typically, synthetic oils do have anti-oxidant ingredients in them and where carbonization is not an issue (like the gas piston face of an AK or the bolt/impingement gas system on an AR) they will be more than adequate, IMHO.
Afterall, as Peter M. Eich points out above, we didn't have all these "super" oils way back when and those guns didn't wither away to rust in a few weeks time. As he points out, it all comes down to committed maintenance and care and it's an excellent point at that.


Peter M. Eich,

Truer words have not been spoken. Excellent post, good points.


INTrooper4255,

15W50 is excellent stuff.



Babalouie,

You are welcome.:)

I am glad that this information was of use to you. Knowing that made my day. Its always nice to know that you helped someone out. Thanks.


Regards,

G/S
 
this thread seems pretty complete, but I work on outboard boat engines, and marine engines need anti-corrosion additives in the oil. Specifically, four stroke oil. I have noticed a fairly big difference in quality of different brands, I work on Yamahas, and think they have the best product going. I don't have time to do salt spray tests, but I think the marine four stroke oil (Yamalube 4M) might do good. I don't think it is synthetic though. It is 10W-30, I think they just came out with a thicker weight too. Anyone think it is worth a try?
 
Durby,

After consulting the manufacturer's product data sheets on a product, the best perspective is gained through direct experience with that product.
When it came to deciding what grade of Mobil 1 would be best for my particular needs, I obtained samples of the five criteria compliant grades and looked at them in terms of not only that they had staified the criteria that I had established, but also how they actually worked for me. Until I actually found the heaviest viscosity that was easiest to work with, didn't migrate all over the place and was compatible with the 'intangibles' that I wanted in a weapons lubricant by actually using them, the spec's were just numbers. I supose that you could call it "informed trial and error".


Some information that I discovered that may (or may not) help you out: I have noticed that the two-stroke oils tend to have lower viscosities and flash points across the board. Seems like the four-stroke stuff will offer less tendency to burn as it has a higher flash point and therefore less volatility as well which means that the four-stroke stuff will most likely be a more 'durable' lubricant.

Good luck,

G/S
 
I'd want to know the same as JohnKSa before "switching" to motor oils.

Meaning, the purpose is to lubricate, easy enough it seems, then clean or help keep clean, which CLP seems to do and some rust protection, reasonable anyway.

A 4 oz bottle of gun oil is expensive compared to Mobil 1, but last quite a long time. I'm not sure I really see the money savings given the costs of "shooting". I view it as "insignificant" IMHO. Particulary if you just "lube" the gun and use other products for cleaning.

Unless gun oils, CLPs, are simply Mobil 1 type oils with "needless" additives, just a "dress-up" to sell at a higher price.
 
45auto,

The answer to your posit with regard to CLP's just being Mobil 1 type oils with "needless" additives that are just a "dress-up" to sell that product is found in the Break-Free CLP MSDS on the Break-Free website. I wouldn't call the additives found in Break-Free "needless" though, as they do indeed serve the purposes for which they are included in the formula.

Within the MSDS Hazardous Ingredients/Identification Section II, you will see listed:

Polyalphaolefin CAS# 68649-12-7 (this is PAO, the very same basestock that is used in the manufacture of Mobil 1, Redline and various other synthetic motor oils.)

As well as hydrotreated Decene 68649-11-6 (a modified olefin) and Aliphatic Petroleum Distillates (these distillates are nothing more than common petroleum solvents).




Please don't misunderstand what I am trying to convey here. I am not attacking Break-Free CLP as it is certainly a fine product in its own right, it does what it says it does.

However, Breakfree CLP is a "compromise" product in that it is simply a PAO that has a small percentage of solvents and preservatives added to its formulation as well as other proprietary ingredients such as Distilled Tall Oil (CAS # 8002-26-4). I refer to it as a "compromise" product only because it is similar in purpose to an all-in-one Shampoo/Conditioner. It does each of its intended tasks, but at the cost of not doing each one of them to its fullest. Even Break-Free must realize this or they would not have come out with an LP (Lubricant/Preservative) that is lacking the solvents that are not required for the preservation and lubrication of the firearm during use and storage.

In short, CLP's, are in most cases, simply a PAO base with several additives meant to 'dress it up' (make it more attractive) for sale to those seeking an "all-in-one solution" to their firearms maintenace needs. Oils by themselves are adequate oxidation prohibitors/preservatives for the most part as they achieve this through establishing a physical as well as a chemical barrier to oxygen.

It is not my intention to advocate the use of Mobil 1 as a means of saving money (sure, it is a bit cheaper, but that is just a little bonus), but rather as an acceptable pure lubricant with no compromise in its lubricative properties being created by the addition of unneeded solvents that are only required in the role of cleaning the gun. If you want an 'all-in-one' product, Break-Free is good stuff, no doubt. If you want a pure lubricant, then Mobil 1 (or Redline for DBR) is the way to go. Neither is "better" than the other. They just serve different purposes.



solvability,

You are right.

It is cheap and effective. Its also quite simple and easy to remember, too.

Red stuff for cleaning; Gold stuff for lubrication.



K9american,

Sorry, I have no experience with it.



G/S
:)
 
What about straight dexron ATF as a lubricant? Is it up to that task? I see it being mentioned as a cleaner and not as a lubricant.
 
Gun Slinger,

Thanks for the clear and concise explanation. You obviously know your stuff so no problem "advocating" one product or not! I'm not "hung up" on oils, to be honest, and I don't try many. I use CLPs, FP-10 in particular, because it seems to lube well, stays on, and it is easier to wipe "dirty stuff" off the gun.
Any quick or aggressive cleaning I do, goes to "real" cleaners like Shooter's Choice, etc, etc.

If I'm "reading" you correctly, the Breakfree LP is a better lubricant than CLP.
"Better" to me would be it stays on longer to prevent wear.
And, if so, your point is simply that if your using a pure "lubricant", might as well use Mobil 1.

Thanks for your time.
 
BTW. If you buy Breakfree by the gallon, it is much much cheaper. Split it with your friends. Good Stuff. Made me like auto loading shotguns again.

I've been on the same quart of Mobil 1 for 7 years now. I use it for guns, fishing reels, etc.

Breakfree is a decent corrosion protector. Not the best, but quite decent for something you can get in a can at Walmart. I have yet to have a firearm rust with Breakfree on it. For general use, it is more than adequate.

I also suspect that a good many of these snake oil gun products are simply repackaged industrial products. Find out what they are, and you can probably by them for 1/1000th of the cost (55 gal drum though).

As mentioned, I would imagine that some of the marine stuff is pretty good
http://www.iboats.com/Anti_Corrosion/dm/category_id.217275--cart_id.768272384--session_id.923390348--view_id.217275--search_type.category

I also have heard that the Boeshield stuff is pretty good.
 
45auto,

You "read" me correctly and on several levels, at that.

Like you, when it comes to cleaning, I use "real" cleaners too, when it comes to 'clean-up' time after the range. It's the right tool for the task. My cleaning regimen is to use Shooters Choice Polymer Safe Formula to clean the gun and then follow it up with Mobil 1 20w50 as a lubricant. I also apply a light coat of the 20w50 upon the surfaces of the gun to protect it as needed and have never had a problem with rust/corrosion.

And yes, you read me correctly, I think that LP is much better suited for long term lubrication and storage because you are not applying a product that is partially composed of a light solvent that will just evaporate and possibly leave behind a residue that I don't want on my guns. It should be more "durable" and long lasting. So, yes, I (or you or we) might as well use Mobil 1 (or Redline, for example) as a pure lubricant.


adweisbe,

Sure, you can use ATF (synthetic or dino) as a weapons lubricant.

It will tend to possess lower kinematic viscosity than most of the oils out there, save for the 0W20, 5W20 weights which will be close (slightly higher than the ATF) to or equal that of the ATF. The only problems that I could see arising with the use of ATF would be a higher rate of migration (seepage) and possibly some mild odor being generated as it heats upon upon the weapon being fired for prolonged time frames. Although it would not be my first choice, it'll certainly work, if you want to use it.



atblis,

You are most likely correct, most of the stuff could probably be purchased in bulk at great savings.

Now if I only had the time to shoot my guns enough to use up that kind of volume.:mad:



G/S
 
I'm glad to see this thread, and have been watching it for several days. You would not believe (or maybe you would) the number of "gun experts" who have told me in no uncertain terms that automotive lubricants will "ruin your gun". I have also been told this by several clerks at various auto parts stores over the years.
I also use CO-OP axle grease over the balls on all my black powder revolvers, and have been since 1968.
Mention that among any group of bp shooters and listen to the howls, but not only does it work better than a lot of the "specialized" lubes, it also cleans up a lot easier, and I still have my first BP revolver, a 51 Navy, that hasn't suffered any damage over the years.
I guess I'm just surprised there hasn't been any of that on here as yet.
 
adweisbe,

Thanks. Neat article.

Although I agree with his descriptions on how lubricants work (he has the boundary vs. film concept down quite well), I diverge from his philosophy wherein he refers to ATF an "a miracle elixir" citing not only the exceptional additive packages, but its lower viscosity as well. True, it is wonderfully oxidation resistant, but it lacks a bit in its viscosity as it tends to be a bit thin for a gun oil all by itself.

It is my opinion that, aside from the issue of migration (wanted or unwanted, with all its attendant advantages and disadvantages), that lubricants having higher viscosities that are between 40 cSt @ 100 F (and 8.00 cSt @212 F) but less than 250-330 cSt @ 100F (primarily greases at and above this range) are better suited for firearms lubrication because even at extremely depressed temperatures exceeding their pour point they still remain more fluid than greases which may have begun to solidify and may restrict firearms function and typically retain their viscosity much better at elevated temperatures due to how they have been formulated to perform in their intended usage. I would also caution anyone using ATF on weapons that have any sort of a polymer construction that it could possibly have an adverse effect upon those components as it is known to attack and degrade certain types of polymers and rubbers.

The article is a very interesting read and one point he makes bears repitition: Stay away from chlorine based compounds in your gun products as they could lead to Stress Corrosion Failure. It is sage advice.

You can use ATF for gun lubrication and it'll do a good job. That's why I included it in the original post. I've seen it used and it is yet another alternative that is available. My preferences (and that is all that they are) run towards the higher viscosity synthetics with greater high and low temperature tolerance as they tend to retain their viscosity better and remain longer than those with lower viscosities.
With the prevalence of polymer components in many pistols designs today, if your desires run towards even thinner oils with excellent additive packages without the risk posed by ATF in that it may possibly effect polymer components in an adverse manner, there are always other possiblilities like Jet Oil II, Jet Oil 254 and Jet Oil 284. They tend to run about $11-$12 per quart and also have excellent high and low temperature tolerance.


Thanks again for the link and your contribution.



tkendrick,

I always try to remember when in a gun store that the clerk is just a salesman trying to make a buck. It puts no money in his pocket to send you trotting off to the auto-parts store down the street to buy a bottle of motor oil or CO-OP axle grease. The self appointed "gun experts"......well, I try not to let 'em see me and if they do try to start a conversation I run for the door.

As for it ruining your gun :rolleyes:......try not to laugh in his face 'cause you know better'n that.


All the best,

G/S
 
solvability,

I like that link. Somehow, it makes me feel...................vindicated. :D

In all seriousness though, even back then they knew that Mobil 1 was good stuff and would do just fine. Kinda takes the questionability out of it.

And I like your method: Red to clean, Gold to lubricate.


S/G
 
... an acceptable pure lubricant with no compromise in its lubricative properties being created by the addition of unneeded solvents that are only required in the role of cleaning the gun.
Click to expand...
Of course there is the issue that many gun owners aren't looking for a pure lubricant. It's very likely that they want a combination lubricant/protectant since corrosion protection is very important to most firearm owners.

In addition, the informal corrosion test results I've seen indicate that Breakfree CLP offers better corrosion protection than the Breakfree LP. I suspect the "unneeded solvent" ;) helps it migrate into small crevices/holes better. Then the solvent evaporates leaving the LP behind to do its job.

FWIW, I am NOT saying that general purpose lubes are a bad idea for use on firearms. I use moly grease in some spots on my guns and also light lithium grease for some firearm applications. I wouldn't hesitate for a moment to use Mobil 1 (or any other automotive oil) in a pinch, but there are benefits to using products that are specially formulated for the application.

In my opinion Mobil 1 is more of a "compromise product" for firearms than something like CLP or EEZOX in the sense that it doesn't include the properties that many (if not most) firearm owners desire. Imagine trying to sell a firearm lubrication product with a warning on the side of the bottle that said: "This is not a corrosion protection lube. Use something else to protect from rust."

One last thought...

How many guns have you seen that were damaged as a result of insufficient lubrication?
How many guns have you seen that were damaged as a result of insufficient corrosion protection?
 
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atblis: I use the T-9 Boeshield on outboards for corrosion protection. A lot of boats I work on live in the water, and get no other attention besides an annual service. As the site you linked says, it was developed by Boeing for aviation use. It created a film over the surface, and moisture/salt spray can't get in. It works great for its intended purpose, one would have to test to see if it works on guns well enough. I will grab some from work and give it a try.
 
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