Capybara
Member
Nice first impressions report Marvin, thank you!
S&W FPC and new folding 9mm PCC?
- Thread starter ECVMatt
- Start date
someguy2800
Member
I could get excited about one in 40! 10mm handgun performance in a carbine length barrel. Would be a good pairing with an M&P 40.
marvin02
Member
I've now got 500 rounds through the FPC with zero issues.
I shot a 6 stage and a 5 stage steel challenge match and an IDPA style match over a span of three days. I shot factory 124 grain, brass cased, FMJ rounds for all matches. I cleaned the gun after each match.
For me the perceived recoil is less than my Ruger PC Carbines or the PSA AR9 that I had.
The weight and just over 30 inch length make it easy to handle.
The cross bolt safety isn't as easily manipulated as an AR style safety. Easy for a righty to disengage, but I had to use my weak hand to engage it.
The bolt lock levers are too small and a pain to engage. To release the bolt if it's locked back I just pulled back the charging handle and released it.
I've used a variety of M&P mags, including the 23 rounders that came with the gun and have had zero issues. Bolt locked back the few times I shot a mag until empty.
10 pull average for the trigger after 500 rounds is 4 lbs, 6 ounces. Out of the box it was 5 lbs, 2 ounces. After the first 100 rounds it was 4 lbs, 8 ounces.
Everyone who handled the gun at the matches was surprised by how light it felt in their hands. I'm pretty certain I sold at least two for S&W in the last few days.
I shot a 6 stage and a 5 stage steel challenge match and an IDPA style match over a span of three days. I shot factory 124 grain, brass cased, FMJ rounds for all matches. I cleaned the gun after each match.
For me the perceived recoil is less than my Ruger PC Carbines or the PSA AR9 that I had.
The weight and just over 30 inch length make it easy to handle.
The cross bolt safety isn't as easily manipulated as an AR style safety. Easy for a righty to disengage, but I had to use my weak hand to engage it.
The bolt lock levers are too small and a pain to engage. To release the bolt if it's locked back I just pulled back the charging handle and released it.
I've used a variety of M&P mags, including the 23 rounders that came with the gun and have had zero issues. Bolt locked back the few times I shot a mag until empty.
10 pull average for the trigger after 500 rounds is 4 lbs, 6 ounces. Out of the box it was 5 lbs, 2 ounces. After the first 100 rounds it was 4 lbs, 8 ounces.
Everyone who handled the gun at the matches was surprised by how light it felt in their hands. I'm pretty certain I sold at least two for S&W in the last few days.
Crosshair
Member
Who are these people who think the Heritage is superior to the Wrangler? Comparable? I can see that. Superior? Gonna need some receipts on that.
chicharrones
needs more ammo
You quoted the guy that thinks that way. Anywho . . . back to the FPC.
chicharrones
needs more ammo
I can get used to a carbine that you pull the bolt carrier backwards to release. Lot's of other guns are similar. Looks like you got a winner, @marvin02 .
Kriss Vector and many others.
Bingo
My son bought one of these the other day for his first firearm purchase, $620 out the door. Range kit with 1 17rd and 2 23rd magazines plus carrying case. Still waiting on an optic & riser to get here.
We took it apart to inspect & clean. Looks like it was test fired before getting here. Didn't really need a cleaning but might as well since it was disassembled. Trigger and charging handle operation have noticeably improved with just a little bit of dry firing.
I agree with an earlier comment that it could use some drop at heel and yep, the bolt latch is slightly annoying.
Weighs in at 8 pounds with the full 63 round load.
Looking forward to shooting it soon.
We took it apart to inspect & clean. Looks like it was test fired before getting here. Didn't really need a cleaning but might as well since it was disassembled. Trigger and charging handle operation have noticeably improved with just a little bit of dry firing.
I agree with an earlier comment that it could use some drop at heel and yep, the bolt latch is slightly annoying.
Weighs in at 8 pounds with the full 63 round load.
Looking forward to shooting it soon.
NIGHTLORD40K
Member
Ya, I was thinking of the Kel-Tec mostly. I played around with an FPC and didn't care for the latching mechanism, charging handle or general handling.
Ended up buying a G19 magwell Sub2k because it fits in my go-bag easily and I already keep plenty of Glock mags in stock.
It may not last 50 years, or even 20- but if it gets me home when the lights go out, Ill be happy with it.
marvin02
Member
I've got over 1,000 rounds through my FPC with zero issues.
I've shot 6 steel challenge matches and a USPSA/IDPA style match. It just runs.
Current setup is a Holosun 510c-gr, a vertical foregrip and a Tandemkross compensator.
The compensator helps more than I thought it would, possibly because the FPC is light in the front. The same compensator on a Ruger PC Carbine didn't make a noticeable difference.
The bolt catch is fine for locking the bolt open, though they are small. It is not a bolt release. That's probably the worst feature.
I can disassemble/reassemble mine with no tools.
I do not fold it except for cleaning and my use case isn't the same as some who are evaluating it. I'm having a ball shooting it at matches and I shoot it as well or better than any of my other steel challenge guns.
I've shot 6 steel challenge matches and a USPSA/IDPA style match. It just runs.
Current setup is a Holosun 510c-gr, a vertical foregrip and a Tandemkross compensator.
The compensator helps more than I thought it would, possibly because the FPC is light in the front. The same compensator on a Ruger PC Carbine didn't make a noticeable difference.
The bolt catch is fine for locking the bolt open, though they are small. It is not a bolt release. That's probably the worst feature.
I can disassemble/reassemble mine with no tools.
I do not fold it except for cleaning and my use case isn't the same as some who are evaluating it. I'm having a ball shooting it at matches and I shoot it as well or better than any of my other steel challenge guns.
Blue Brick
Member
wesmonster
Member
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2019
- Messages
- 390
I just picked up an FPC a few days ago, have not had a chance to shoot it yet but so far my initial impressions are good.
I also own a gen2 SUB2k, TNW ASR 10mm carbine, CX4 Storm and used to have several ARs in 9mm, several Hi Points in 9mm, .45 & 10mm, Ruger PCC, gen 1 Scorpion Evo, Chiappa PAK 9, and so on.
Don't expect sub-MOA accuracy from any PCC. If you can hit a pie plate at 100 yards you're above the curve. For me PCCs are 25 too 50 yard guns, after that I'm grabbing .300bo or 7.62x39.
Compared to my SUB, the FPC has better ergonomics. A SUB unfolded is a very small carbine, much easier to conceal than the FPC. But locked open the FPC feels like a full size rifle. I'm running the small backstrap and the grip feels very much like my Shield .45.
The mag storage in the stock is clever but I'm not sure I want that much weight on board. The mag release in the stock is a pivoting lever, press the opposite side to release you stored mag. Not an easy operation one handed. With no mags on board the rifle is still a bit rear weight biased which to me makes a 5.5lb rifle feel even lighter.
At $50 a pop for S&W 23 round mags tossing two in the box helps justify the asking price. I don't own any M&P double stack mags and for now don't feel the need to buy more.
The stock really looks chunky & awkward and I think Taccom3G has a minimalist replacement that is adjustable by shims, but the factory stock feels great with a very good cheek weld.
I'm not a fan of Ruger's breakdown barrel setup, sold my PCC 9mm braced pistol last year and my Charger takedown pistol recently. I own a lot of Rugers but the takedowns were not my favorites. If you're gonna make a removable barrel, you should be able to mount optics on the barrel, not the receiver.
I did read of some issues with early FPCs losing their firing pin retaining pins, the early ones were tapered and there was some discussion about them possibly being installed backwards. The S&W fix is a new pin with a head.
Most PCC triggers are just plain terrible. My Hi Points had lighter triggers than my CX4 & Evo out of the box. At least there were fixes for the CX4 & Evo but even the best PCC triggers can't compare to a basic GI single stage AR trigger. The FPC is good, I guess this is what all M&Ps come with, it's an improvement over my Shield gen 1/gen2 triggers, and those are what I consider above average for a factory trigger. FPC is as good as any of my modern Ruger bolt actions. Shoot my stock SUB2k trigger once and you won't complain about any other trigger, ever.
And my most favorite feature of the FPC is the magwell in the grip. You've made this rifle action about 6" shorter vs a mag forward layout.
I also own a gen2 SUB2k, TNW ASR 10mm carbine, CX4 Storm and used to have several ARs in 9mm, several Hi Points in 9mm, .45 & 10mm, Ruger PCC, gen 1 Scorpion Evo, Chiappa PAK 9, and so on.
Don't expect sub-MOA accuracy from any PCC. If you can hit a pie plate at 100 yards you're above the curve. For me PCCs are 25 too 50 yard guns, after that I'm grabbing .300bo or 7.62x39.
Compared to my SUB, the FPC has better ergonomics. A SUB unfolded is a very small carbine, much easier to conceal than the FPC. But locked open the FPC feels like a full size rifle. I'm running the small backstrap and the grip feels very much like my Shield .45.
The mag storage in the stock is clever but I'm not sure I want that much weight on board. The mag release in the stock is a pivoting lever, press the opposite side to release you stored mag. Not an easy operation one handed. With no mags on board the rifle is still a bit rear weight biased which to me makes a 5.5lb rifle feel even lighter.
At $50 a pop for S&W 23 round mags tossing two in the box helps justify the asking price. I don't own any M&P double stack mags and for now don't feel the need to buy more.
The stock really looks chunky & awkward and I think Taccom3G has a minimalist replacement that is adjustable by shims, but the factory stock feels great with a very good cheek weld.
I'm not a fan of Ruger's breakdown barrel setup, sold my PCC 9mm braced pistol last year and my Charger takedown pistol recently. I own a lot of Rugers but the takedowns were not my favorites. If you're gonna make a removable barrel, you should be able to mount optics on the barrel, not the receiver.
I did read of some issues with early FPCs losing their firing pin retaining pins, the early ones were tapered and there was some discussion about them possibly being installed backwards. The S&W fix is a new pin with a head.
Most PCC triggers are just plain terrible. My Hi Points had lighter triggers than my CX4 & Evo out of the box. At least there were fixes for the CX4 & Evo but even the best PCC triggers can't compare to a basic GI single stage AR trigger. The FPC is good, I guess this is what all M&Ps come with, it's an improvement over my Shield gen 1/gen2 triggers, and those are what I consider above average for a factory trigger. FPC is as good as any of my modern Ruger bolt actions. Shoot my stock SUB2k trigger once and you won't complain about any other trigger, ever.
And my most favorite feature of the FPC is the magwell in the grip. You've made this rifle action about 6" shorter vs a mag forward layout.
Capybara
Member
Great report, thanks!
Justin
Moderator Emeritus
One of the few guns where a magazine that's fully loaded is worth more than the gun itself.
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