hueyville
Member
Not as bad as '86. Learned from that one what others should ne learning now.
I don't think this ammo shortage will be as bad as the last time.
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MagnunJoe
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Much, much worse.
blue32
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Never shot a pistol until I got into shooting in '08. $13/50 rounds was normal. I got into reloading a few months later and it was somewhat difficult to find components but not like it is now. I had to time my purchase of an AR because thats when Obama was coming to office and everyone was really scared.
But what we have now is far worse. I never really had time to stock up on primers or other components. I managed to save a few thousand large and small pistol primers. I switched to plated bullets only because fmj became hard to get. Then I switched to lead when shortages of plated started. Now I face a month lead time to get lead.
This isn't going to end any time soon. The president we have now conjures up the worst fears of the gun owning public. As long as he and others who support him are in office, this bad dream will continue.
But what we have now is far worse. I never really had time to stock up on primers or other components. I managed to save a few thousand large and small pistol primers. I switched to plated bullets only because fmj became hard to get. Then I switched to lead when shortages of plated started. Now I face a month lead time to get lead.
This isn't going to end any time soon. The president we have now conjures up the worst fears of the gun owning public. As long as he and others who support him are in office, this bad dream will continue.
MachIVshooter
Member
This is the worst I've ever seen or heard of. In 2008, we saw minor shortages and 30-50% price increases. This time, "OUT OF STOCK" is the standard banner, and prices are frequently 300%+ what they were.
I honestly don't expect stock and pricing to normalize until at least mid-2014.
I honestly don't expect stock and pricing to normalize until at least mid-2014.
BSA1
member
Why did people jump to the irrational conclusion that .22 ammo is to be taxed much more, or will be produced in smaller quantities etc?
How is it irrational for gun owners to not believe what the President has publically stated, the half dozen anti-gun bills that have been introduced in The House Of Representatives alone since January 3rd and the hundreds of anti-gun laws are being introduced and anti-gun laws that have been recently passed in New York and Colorado
While you do not believe (and may even support "compromise") that the President and anti-gunners want to disarm Americans anyway possible fortunately millions of other Americans are realizing it is a very real possibility.
Definition of IRRATIONAL
: not rational: as
a (1): not endowed with reason or understanding (2): lacking usual or normal mental clarity or coherence
b: not governed by or according to reason <irrational fears>
How is it irrational for gun owners to not believe what the President has publically stated, the half dozen anti-gun bills that have been introduced in The House Of Representatives alone since January 3rd and the hundreds of anti-gun laws are being introduced and anti-gun laws that have been recently passed in New York and Colorado
While you do not believe (and may even support "compromise") that the President and anti-gunners want to disarm Americans anyway possible fortunately millions of other Americans are realizing it is a very real possibility.
Definition of IRRATIONAL
: not rational: as
a (1): not endowed with reason or understanding (2): lacking usual or normal mental clarity or coherence
b: not governed by or according to reason <irrational fears>
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MattShlock
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Last time at least there was surplus stuff waiting in the wings internationally. That was all consumed.
bannockburn
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Not only as bad as last time but much, much worse.
Sav .250
Member
More serious factors than in the past .Talk of banding this and that. If one happens to own one of these ,"this or that`s," you better believe they can`t buy enough ammo to suit their needs .
No doubt the supply will run behind the plow for some time but will catch up some where down the road. Until "demand" settles down, the shelves will be empty....almost.
No doubt the supply will run behind the plow for some time but will catch up some where down the road. Until "demand" settles down, the shelves will be empty....almost.
sansone
Member
unless you are new to shooting we have already seen this time is worse than when king O was first elected.. As someone stated, the Dems were secretive regarding the gun grab the first time. Now the gloves are off.. I want Uncle Sam back
I have to join the chorus and say this is worse than "last time" (2009). Thus, I didn't vote in the poll, because that option isn't available.
I've got a gun show coming up this weekend. I'm thinking about going, just to compare with the one (same venue and probably same vendors) I went to on December 30. At that one, while everybody was looking for EBR's, I came home with a NIB Ruger .308 GSR for a decent price -- $900 OTD, with roughly $75 in tax, so about $825, which is probably what was a good street price even before all the panic.
This time, I'll probably just be hitting the ammo/reloading vendors. Back in 2009, I remember primers hitting $40/1000, but at least they were available (but with limits on the number of boxes per sale) at the gun shows when I couldn't find any online. So there is a yardstick of sorts: if not available, or more than $40/1000, then it's worse than last time.
I've got a gun show coming up this weekend. I'm thinking about going, just to compare with the one (same venue and probably same vendors) I went to on December 30. At that one, while everybody was looking for EBR's, I came home with a NIB Ruger .308 GSR for a decent price -- $900 OTD, with roughly $75 in tax, so about $825, which is probably what was a good street price even before all the panic.
This time, I'll probably just be hitting the ammo/reloading vendors. Back in 2009, I remember primers hitting $40/1000, but at least they were available (but with limits on the number of boxes per sale) at the gun shows when I couldn't find any online. So there is a yardstick of sorts: if not available, or more than $40/1000, then it's worse than last time.
Fishslayer
Member
^^^ This.
They are also bandying about ideas re "ammo taxes" and mail order ammo bans. This will cause ammo prices to go through the roof. Imagine a brick of .22 for $75...
This time around a lot of people are getting into reloading. In '09-'10 I could find components if I looked really hard. Not so now. The makers are even backordered on presses & dies.
CoRoMo
Member
Not only is it worse this time around, less than 8% of shooters know it.
My dad called me up a few weeks ago and said...
"I ran out of .22lr ammo and I've been looking around at a few stores but it's sold out everywhere. Do you know what's caused all the ammo to be out of stock?"
...sigh.
Actually I was just thinking about that a while ago. The shocking thing to me is that 550 bullets sells for $20. That's .036 cents per round. Less than 4 cents. How does an ammo company make a profit on a single bullet that takes 40grains of lead, some brass, chemicals to make the primer and the gunpowder plus the electricity to run it all...all on 4 cents.
MachIVshooter
Member
Quantity. Trust me, they're still turning a profit. Even if it's only $0.005/round, that's still $2.50/brick, times tens of thousands of bricks. I don't recall exactly, but something on the order of 4 billion rounds of .22 LR are consumed annually. At 1/2 cent profit per round, that's $20 million profit.
That's also why .22 Rimfire, and especially cheap .22 LR, has QC and reliability issues. Churning them out in that quantity at that price, you're not going to see the kind of consistent quality you do with more expensive centerfire ammo.
It is in volume - just watched a video from a few years ago showing the making of 22 at CCI. They were putting out 4 million a day. Now I just need a measly .00025% of those to make it into my possession.
Found the link: http://www.outdoorhub.com/stories/video-have-you-ever-wondered-how-rimfire-ammunition-is-made/
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captain awesome
Member
you only need 10 rounds?
OH_Spartan
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definitely worse here in Ohio. I decided against buying a slingshot when I couldn't find rocks for it.
MattShlock
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That works if you think "no" means it will be worse. I think they mean it WON'T be as bad but better. So, most here know it's worse and isn't ending...
wally
Member
From here, it already looks worse.
.00025 x 4,000,000 = 1000
Surprisingly hard to find that many rounds right now. Good thing one of my rifles shoots shorts.
Onward Allusion
Member
Er, no...
You'd missed 2 decimals when you indicated percentage. .00025% is .0000025... 10 rounds
I'm just messing with ya! Seriously, I can't believe that I can't locate a few bricks of 22LR online or at the stores. I used to think I was pretty safe because I usually only shoot 22LR. Hell, these days, I need to stick to my bow!
You'd missed 2 decimals when you indicated percentage. .00025% is .0000025... 10 rounds
I'm just messing with ya! Seriously, I can't believe that I can't locate a few bricks of 22LR online or at the stores. I used to think I was pretty safe because I usually only shoot 22LR. Hell, these days, I need to stick to my bow!
I don't know how many ammo plants there are in the USA; but I doubt it's many? I'm surprised more surplus and foreign made ammo isn't coming in.
If Chinese ammo can't be brought directly into the country; how about indirectly? Same ammo; just coming from another country? Overnight billionaire for anyone who pulls it off. Bring in a few container ships worth. Use it for practice/fun ammo and save the good stuff.
Some place in the world are ammo bunkers full of 9mm, etc just waiting to be liberated.
If Chinese ammo can't be brought directly into the country; how about indirectly? Same ammo; just coming from another country? Overnight billionaire for anyone who pulls it off. Bring in a few container ships worth. Use it for practice/fun ammo and save the good stuff.
Some place in the world are ammo bunkers full of 9mm, etc just waiting to be liberated.
scaatylobo
Member
To the O.P.
I vividly remember the last shortage and that was NOTHING compared to what we are seeing today.
There was NEVER,EVER a time when during the last shortage,you could not find ANY .22 rimfire ammo at Wally world and a million other stores.
Its ALL GONE,so as far as this shooter sees we are FUBAR.
Until or IF there is a drastic turnabout,keep your ammo for limited practice.
I vividly remember the last shortage and that was NOTHING compared to what we are seeing today.
There was NEVER,EVER a time when during the last shortage,you could not find ANY .22 rimfire ammo at Wally world and a million other stores.
Its ALL GONE,so as far as this shooter sees we are FUBAR.
Until or IF there is a drastic turnabout,keep your ammo for limited practice.
orionengnr
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This one is exactly the same in every respect. First the centerfire ammo disappears, then the rimfire ammo, then the components. Then everything shows up on GB or at Gun Shows for 200-400% of previous retail.
Same stories about gun shop employees cleaning out WM, etc, then marking it up at their shops. Same new posts every day about "hoarding", etc. Same thing when I show up at the range--nobody shooting, and the same reason--nobody can find ammo.
Nope, so far, I haven't seen one bit of difference.
The real question is...is the bitching worse this time? The answer to that is, so far, "yes".
There is a factor of 100 difference.
Same stories about gun shop employees cleaning out WM, etc, then marking it up at their shops. Same new posts every day about "hoarding", etc. Same thing when I show up at the range--nobody shooting, and the same reason--nobody can find ammo.
Nope, so far, I haven't seen one bit of difference.
The real question is...is the bitching worse this time? The answer to that is, so far, "yes".
.00025 is not the same thing as .00025%
There is a factor of 100 difference.
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