Waiting Time for Suppressor Approval?

[The Glockodile]

Do clarify - my former FFL had a range that they operated on the premises, and

Conjugal visits…

with our NFA items were allowed...

Is this actually illegal?

This is what both N555 and I are referring to.

 

[Soonerpesek]

Is this actually illegal?

It is the property of the FFL until they transfer it to you, so yes it is legal for them to allow you to use it UNDER THEIR SUPERVISION.....

............................let my chastizing begin.....................

 

[dogtown tom]

Well bub, when
markr6754 wrote ".... I wish they'd let me borrow it while it's still in jail. You know...like a supervised release....".
That doesn't sound like he's talking about using it at the FFL/SOT's range does it? A "conjugal visit" occurs at the dealers range and remains in lawful possession of the FFL/SOT.
markr6754 understands that he cannot "borrow it......like a supervised release" because he understands thats not legal. Thats why he wished for such.

Yet you responded:
N555: "...Some dealers will do that, especially if they have an on premises shooting range..."

So you see thats where you are wrong....dealers will NOT DO THAT. Its illegal. Further, when you wrote "especially if they have an on premises shooting range.." shows that you understand that there is a difference in a conjugal visit at the dealers premises vs. what markr6754 is wishing for......that they would let him borrow it...like on supervised release.

So, yeah, your post is nonsense.

 

[dogtown tom]

Do clarify - my former FFL had a range that they operated on the premises, and
with our NFA items were allowed...

Is this actually illegal?

This is what both N555 and I are referring to.

No. A "conjugal visit" occurs at the dealers premises or at another location with the FFL/SOT present.

 

[dogtown tom]

It is the property of the FFL until they transfer it to you, so yes it is legal for them to allow you to use it UNDER THEIR SUPERVISION.....

............................let my chastizing begin.....................

More accurately, the NFA firearm remains in the lawful possession of the FFL/SOT. If you bought it, its your property. The dealer no longer has an ownership interest on that firearm.

I have 300 odd NFA firearms sitting in my safes....not a one of them is my property. They are owned by my customers awaiting ATF permission that allows me to transfer them.

 

[Soonerpesek]

lawful possession

Possession is 9/10 of the law.......................= property..............

Give your micro-managing skills a break.......................we ALL know what was implied with the conjugal visit statement...........

We dont need to be suppressor-splained evry time ....

 

[dogtown tom]

Possession is 9/10 of the law.......................= property..............

With ATF possession is 10/10ths of the law. ATF doesn't give two hoots about who owns, bought or paid for anything. It all about possession.

Give your micro-managing skills a break.......................

No.

we ALL know what was implied with the conjugal visit statement............

Yet N555 doesn't.

We dont need to be suppressor-splained evry time ...

Apparently you do.

 

[Soonerpesek]

Apparently you do.

HAHA.......!!

I bet you, the varmint, and the bush would make a great team........

 

[Demi-human]

I also thought N555 was being too vague with his verbiage when I read it the first time. (No offense, 555.)
Tom has explicitly clarified it, by law, for anyone else who may have found the thread to read it.
Which I appreciate.

Laws are like firearms, one mistake can change your life. Firearms laws are expectedly crocodilian. (Many Draconian, but I digress.)

So,
Just like a Conjugal Visit, you go in. They don’t let your suppressor out.

Yes, if the dealer doesn’t have a range attached, he would have to drive out to wherever the range is and stand there in possession of the article.

Like a pistol in Michigan, I can hand it to you and let you try it out, while I stand and watch, or keep you penned on my property which is also in my possession. I can’t let you take it home to your range to try it and then bring it back. I must remain in possession.
I even bet if something happened on my own back 40 and I wasn’t there, a big deal would still be made of it. They like to pile on.
Why skirt so close to the maelstrom?

Now, what all this has to do with wait times in 2022 is confusing. I think I’ve drifted the thread.

 

[James Petti]

1 year and 20 days. Paper. I bought a Rem. 700 .308 with a 20” threaded barrel some years ago, never considering a suppressor, just wanted a short, handy rifle. While looking for primers at a local shop, I asked about the things and within the hour, started down that long road. They made no promises as to wait times other than that they expected them to be long.

On my phone is an app, NIOSH sound level meter which says it gives a 30-32 decibel reduction. We live (literally) in the midst of nowhere and have enough land to have a small range on it. Before the suppressor, wife says she could hear the shots from the house, now she cannot. I have loaded a few sub-sonic rounds which make about as much or a little more noise as an air rifle but I don't think they are particularity useful. If it were to be done over, with what I've learned, I would elect not to. I still would not shoot full power without hearing protection, and there is no one near us who is within earshot. Each person should fully consider their own situation and needs carefully, as the money is as long as the wait. And now the rifle is long too!

 

[dogtown tom]

.....On my phone is an app, NIOSH sound level meter which says it gives a 30-32 decibel reduction.

Cell phone sound meter apps may be perfectly fine for measuring sound levels at a concert, a jet during takeoff or the peak noise coming from the neighbors party next door, but they are terrible at accurately measuring the sound of a gunshot. In fact, most commercial stand alone sound meters can't do it either and there are only a couple of sound meters that can, mostly because of the extremely brief period of noise that a gunshot produces.

And now the rifle is long too!

And thats how you fall into the world of SBR's.

 

[James Petti]

Part of the urge to buy the thing was that it's something the government would rather I not have. Unless of course Cesar gets his cut. Good thing for us he doesn't kept up with inflation and charge accordingly.

I suppose if there is a reasonable use for them it would be defensive in-home so as not to go immediately deaf should a shot become necessary.

The stamp is pretty. Does anyone know, since that if I go off property with the thing I must carry a copy of the paperwork with me, if a picture on the phone (right next to the app) would be an acceptable copy? I don't even carry paper money anymore.

This is not to discourage anyone who is still thinking about them. I'm sure it won't be my last mistake.

 

[dogtown tom]

Part of the urge to buy the thing was that it's something the government would rather I not have. Unless of course Cesar gets his cut. Good thing for us he doesn't kept up with inflation and charge accordingly.

Remember, we (or our great grandparents ) elected the people that voted the National Firearms Act into law. "The government" isn't some magical or mythical entity that exists on its own....we put it there, we can change it, we can eliminate it. Caesar only get his cut if we decide to let him. The ATF employees I deal with don't care if you have NFA firearms. Not a one in my decade of NFA sales and transfers, has every said anything remotely close to negative.

The NFA was intended to make ownership and possession of certain firearms prohibitively expensive. That plan worked up until about fifteen or twenty years ago when inflation rendered the $200 transfer tax almost inconsequential to most buyers. ATF doesn't keep a penny of that transfer tax, it goes directly to the US Treasury as do all taxes. The expense of administering and managing the NFA registry exceeds revenue....it costs more to run than the transfer taxes received.

The stamp is pretty. Does anyone know, since that if I go off property with the thing I must carry a copy of the paperwork with me, if a picture on the phone (right next to the app) would be an acceptable copy? I don't even carry paper money anymore.

The stamp is pretty, but you only get an actual revenue stamp if you file a paper Form 1 or Form 4. eForm 1's and 4's jusy get a .pdf emailed to you.
No federal law or ATF regulation requires you have the stamp/F1/F4 in your possession, but federal law does require you show it to a federal agent on request. If you have your silencer and a federal agent asks to see your stamp and its at home.....he can take your silencer until you show yor stamp.

Does that happen? No. A federal agent will be the last person to demand your stamp. He can easily verify your registration staus with a quick phone call.
Your local PD? Different story.

 

[James Petti]

I stopped believing in sky magic when I was nine. Now you tell me that the government isn't capable of performing miracles? All hope is lost.
I did get an actual stamp, signed by the approver. We don't have a local anything, much less PD. Probably won't go off the reservation anyhow.

Thanks for the info.

 

[tankertom]

I submitted 4 eForm 4s for customer in January. The fastest one was approved in 78 days and the slowest was 120 days. I think it is actually getting slower. I currently have a customer at 60 days and I don't expect it for a while. Paper form 4s are running 10 months or so for individual and 14-16 months for trusts.

 

[N555]

Ahhh I got to try out my xm177 while its in nfa jail. Yeah $269 very well spent. I want to run it on about an 11.5 inch sbr eventually but all I had to try it out on was a 16 inch midlength with factory ammo.
I expect it to work very well with my "carbine load" which is a 55gr bullet with about a start load of H322.
The dealer won't let you barrow it. You might be able to use it briefly in the dealers presence.
Don't listen to dog town Tom he is won't admit he was wrong and keeps trying to twist the "visit" into something it isn't just so he can blow his nfa violation dog whistle at something.

 

[irishlad]

Don't listen to dog town Tom he is won't admit he was wrong and keeps trying to twist the "visit" into something it isn't just so he can blow his nfa violation dog whistle at something.

I don't believe he has stated anything wrong. I believe he was clear the FFL holder needed to be present.

 

[dogtown tom]

Reading comprehension seems to be an ongoing problem.

 

[N555]

I don't believe he has stated anything wrong. I believe he was clear the FFL holder needed to be present.

See page 1.

 

[dogtown tom]

See page 1.

Well, that's enlightening.
Just point out what I wrote that isn't correct.
Be specific.

I believe what you wrote to be erroneous, misguided, faulty....basically nonsense and gave you a detailed explanation why. If you think you are correct, then present a decent rebuttal.

 

[irishlad]

See page 1.

I did. I don't see how it could be any clearer.

"Especially"?
"Some dealers" would be committing a federal crime by letting someone take possession before the tax stamp is in hand. I've never heard of "some dealers" who are that stupid. Further, the buyer would also be committing a federal crime by being in possession of an NFA firearm that is not in his lawful possession.

The ONLY lawful way for an FFL to let the buyer use his NFA firearm during the approval process is by the firearm being in the dealers possession. Either at his range on his licensed premises or at another location with that dealer in attendance.

In no shape, matter or form is it legal for "some dealers" to allow an NFA firearm to be taken away from his licensed premises without the dealer accompanying it.

 

[The Glockodile]

Hm.

Started mid - March, approved today.

Seven and a half months.

 

[markr6754]

8 months and counting. Meanwhile, they've declared my braced pistol, the intended firearm for my can, illegal.

 

[Bosn Ski]

8 months and counting. Meanwhile, they've declared my braced pistol, the intended firearm for my can, illegal.

7 months 2 weeks and same same for braced pistol and can.

 

[irishlad]

June 9, 2022 eform 4 , approved March 20, 2023.