Why aren’t .45acp carbines more popular?

[NIGHTLORD40K]

And a 9mm at rifle ranges is better?

I was thinking home defense and sport, not tieroneninjaswatoperators.

Well, flatter trajectory out to 200 or so, not much energy left beyond that even if you hit something.
There's no one perfect gun of cartridge for all situations, but the OPs question was why aren't .45 PCCs more popular. The answer is they are less versatile and more expensive.
I don't deny they can be perfectly adequate for a limited mission set, or even more effective in some situations.

 

[NIGHTLORD40K]

I had rather shoot beside a PCC than a RCC, especially on an indoor range.

Amen- especially a .308 like the Socom16. Jeezus, they are loud.....

 

[Hugger-4641]

I would really like to see a 10mm carbine in delayed blowback or piston system. I'd buy that for sure. 45acp, meh, not really enough case volume to maximize the potential.

 

[valnar]

.45ACP doesn't really benefit from longer barrels either, unless you're shooting those ultra-light bullets. But then, why bother.

 

[Mosin77]

I sort of take it for granted that a PCC will be used for pistol range and maybe a bit longer (shots that are within the performance envelope of the ammo but not necessarily of the typical pistol shooter.) The mission for sub guns since WWII has basically been close range combat. Which, in civilian context means semi auto and self defense, not really 150 yard shots. (If I’m shooting a critter at that range I have a rifle shooting rifle rounds.) I’m pretty sure that under 75 yards a .45 and a 9 are both going to be “combat accurate.”

So, if they’re being used for recreation (because they’re fun) then I totally get 9mm. It’s cheaper. And that one will be effective enough in a pinch for serious use. And for operator use I guess it makes sense too. Mag and ammo interchangeability? Though not sure to be honest how often this happens in real life.

I guess I’m just surprised that in the conversation about self/home defense, .45 doesn’t seem to have a prominent place at the table even though it seems clearly more effective than popular options. And all its main drawbacks except cost are non-applicable in carbine form. I’d almost venture to say there’s more chatter about .30 carbine than .45!

 

[tarosean]

I would really like to see a 10mm carbine in delayed blowback or piston system.

Two have already been mentioned in this thread.. CMMG Banshee uses a radial delayed blowback system and the Kriss Vector uses their delayed blowback Super V system.

 

[GRIZ22]

My opinion.

1. 9mm is more popular. Many don't want to stock an extra caliber.

2. Trajectory of 45 is like a rainbow. I have a 45 picture. It's zeroed for 50 yds. Can't see using it beyond that range.

 

[Bronco72]

I have a CMMG Banshee 11" barrel suppressed in 45 ACP! It is for stuff up close, less than 100 yds.. I have three friends that have various 9mm carbines that compete. I asked them why the 9mm, they all said economics was more of an issue that performance. They said if they did not compete and burn so much ammo they would have gone 45! That's all I got to contribute

 

[EMC45]

My only beef with my Camp Carbie is that the buffer crumbled in the receiver (common on the older guns) and it cracked the wrist of the stock, which is also a common byproduct of the crumbled buffer. I put a Black Jack buffer in it and it's good to go now. The sight on mine wouldn't stay on either. Tried everything too.

I use a little cheapy scope and it suits my fun gun needs. Not storming beaches or kicking in doors with mine. I just shoot paper and have fun.

 

[12Bravo20]

My only beef with my Camp Carbie is that the buffer crumbled in the receiver (common on the older guns) and it cracked the wrist of the stock, which is also a common byproduct of the crumbled buffer. I put a Black Jack buffer in it and it's good to go now. The sight on mine wouldn't stay on either. Tried everything too.

I use a little cheapy scope and it suits my fun gun needs. Not storming beaches or kicking in doors with mine. I just shoot paper and have fun.

The reason Marlin buffers crumble is twofold. One is the material that was used to make them, it gets brittle with age. Second was that people use to like using chlorinated brake/carb cleaners to remove carbon. Chlorinated brake/carb cleaners will fall out destroy the Marlin white buffers. I had to replace plenty of buffers and fix any associated damages to Marlin Model 60's for the same reason.

 

[CapnMac]

Second was that people use to like using chlorinated brake/carb cleaners to remove carbon. Chlorinated brake/carb cleaners will fall out destroy the Marlin white buffers.

Given the amount of carbon let loose in a Camp 45 after just a magazine, not a huge surprise. The Blackjack blue buffers also work in the Camp 45.

Camp 45 can mount near any optic a person could want, given the upper is already tapped for mounts. While traditional glass definitely works, RDS really shines on a Camp 45. The "ideal" is likely something like a Primary Arms SLx 3x--just enough magnification for target identification, low enough to retain field of view to pistol ranges.

The 45acp may arc like a rainbow, but a Camp 45 will easily let you reach out 100 yards. Which is not something that van be said of the M3 series, nor the UMP, nor the Reising (maybe a tommy or hyde has the sights for it--put you will need a spotter).

The question for OP may not be so much about "why no 45acp PCC?" but in the "why so few PCC?"

 

[Riomouse911]

Cost is a huge one, especially with the price of living continuing to rise as Ol’ Uncle Joe drives us off a cliff. I am getting 9mm 115 or 124 gr fmj at 14 bucks a box. Cheapest .45 fmj I have found was 26 bucks a box.

That said; If Ruger made a takedown .45 carbine like their 9mm that took Glock mags, I would buy one tomorrow.


Stay safe.

 

[MikeInOr]

Cost is a huge one, especially with the price of living continuing to rise as Ol’ Uncle Joe drives us off a cliff. I am getting 9mm 115 or 124 gr fmj at 14 bucks a box. Cheapest .45 fmj I have found was 26 bucks a box.

That said; If Ruger made a takedown .45 carbine like their 9mm that took Glock mags, I would buy one tomorrow.

View attachment 1168639
Stay safe.

Nice perfectly sized case! What case did you use to make the case? What case did you to make it?

P.S. I would buy a Ruger PC Charger in .45acp or 10mm.

 

[Riomouse911]

Nice perfectly sized case! What case did you use to make the case? What case did you to make it?

I got the idea from a THR member who posted theirs, I don’t recall who it was to give full credit.

It is a Ridgid 20” tool case from Home Depot. The foam insert is a Kaisen foam insert for the Ridgid case. I cut the foam to fit and glued it in place with silicone adhesive.



Stay safe.

 

[d2wing]

The market drives what is made to sell. If the demand was there then the gun would be. And it is.

 

[BLACKHAWKNJ]

I have both the Marlins. Both good shooters, both long out of production-? The Old Story-"They Oughta Make.." Then somebody does-and they don't sell. Or the demand is quickly met.
A project I have toyed with is an interchangeable barrel bolt action in 45 ACP/45 Winchester Magnum using my 1911 style magazines. Perhaps one in 9MMP/ 38 Super. A bolt action to make the brass easier to retrieve.

 

[Riomouse911]

I have both the Marlins. Both good shooters, both long out of production-? The Old Story-"They Oughta Make.." Then somebody does-and they don't sell. Or the demand is quickly met.
A project I have toyed with is an interchangeable barrel bolt action in 45 ACP/45 Winchester Magnum using my 1911 style magazines. Perhaps one in 9MMP/ 38 Super. A bolt action to make the brass easier to retrieve.

Like a Spanish Destroyer carbine? They came mostly in 9x23 Largo (Bergmann-Bayard, etc.) but some were imported in 9mm Para and (allegedly) .38 ACP.

One in .45 Win Mag would be cool

Stay safe.

 

[earlthegoat2]

I swear some folks just want something different for the sake of it sometimes.

Let’s be real here. 9mm, 10mm, or 45 bolt actions and lever guns would sell about 12 per year and then just be turds on retailers shelves for a decade.

Everyone seems to want every action type of their favorite cartridge. I’m right there with you. I could put some good use to a drilling with a 20 ga, 450 Bushmaster, and 22 Mag chambers. I just don’t understand why nobody makes one

For semi auto PCCs, well there may be more of a market but trust and believe, if there was money to be made on it, all the manufacturers would be making them in spades. There not so just go custom to get what you want.

 

[Mosin77]

I actually don’t have a real hankering for .45acp per se. It simply makes sense to me as a better tool for the purpose and it’s not too boutique. Ballistically it’s a better fit for the “serious” mission profile of most PCCs.

As far as I can tell from this thread it’s main failing is that it doesn’t meet the actual use case, which is plinking/fun/recreational shooting, because as we know, 9mm is dramatically cheaper. And if 9mm is cheaper and close to as good, most users will vote with their wallet.

 

[JFrame]

I recall that, back in the day, one of the gun rags (I believe it was Guns & Ammo) did ballistic tests of various loads in four calibers (9mm, .40 S&W, 10mm, and .45 ACP) fired from both carbines and handguns. The .45 was the only cartridge to LOSE velocity in one of its loadings when fired from a longer barrel.

Having said that, I would love to have a carbine chambered in .45 ACP.

 

[EMC45]

I got the idea from a THR member who posted theirs, I don’t recall who it was to give full credit.

It is a Ridgid 20” tool case from Home Depot. The foam insert is a Kaisen foam insert for the Ridgid case. I cut the foam to fit and glued it in place with silicone adhesive.

View attachment 1168649View attachment 1168650

Stay safe.

You did it perfectly too.

 

[Charlie98]

I've always wanted a PCC in .45ACP... don't know why, the numbers don't add up... but I love the .45, and I think a .45 PCC would be fun. Missed out on the Marlin, but part of me hopes Ruger will 'new and improve' the Camp Carbine, and re-release it. Or maybe an M1 Carbine version like the Chiappa 9mm M1 Carbine, but in .45. Buddy of mine has the CMMG (Resolute?) and loves it... and he has owned more PCC's than you could shake a stick at. I've tried to talk him out of his CMMG... but no sale.

I guess the biggest problem is the balance of a .45 PCC... that is, a quality build, at a marketable price, in a configuration that is reliable, in a package that doesn't weigh 10# or more... and preferably not an ugly duckling like the Ruger 9mm PCC and some of the others.

As much as I like the idea of a .45 PCC, I'm willing to acknowledge that they make very little sense outside of some very specific roles. Having said that, I own and shoot quite a few firearms that make ZERO sense to own, to include their expensive and elusive cartridges and handloading supplies.

 

[Charlie Martinez]

I started shooting CF handguns in the 70's when the 9mm and the 38 Special were considered barely adequate as a "manstoppers". In those days the minimum handgun manstopping rounds were the 357 Magnum and the 45 ACP. For me the muzzle blast of the 357 Mag was excessive for unprotected ears so I for HD and personal defense I got my first 1911 and never looked back. I have accumulated a lifetime supply of 45 ACP lead bullets and enough primers, powder and cases to last me a long time so in my case cost factors favor the 45 ACP.

For a while I considered getting a High Point carbine in 45 ACP to accompany my 1911 but I decided to go with an AR instead. Maybe I'm old fashioned but in spite of its advantages over the 45 the 9mm (as well as the 40 S&W) has never generated a lot of excitement for me. For me a pistol cartridge carbine is nothing more than a more accurate version of a pistol for close quarters combat therefore trajectories at ranges beyond 75-100 yards don't matter. So bottom line, I would definitely prefer the 45 ACP carbine over the 9mm.

 

[jbhighroad]

Mech tech .. carbine conversion for many pistols. A lot of fun.

 

[MikeInOr]

The market drives what is made to sell. If the demand was there then the gun would be. And it is.

Somewhat true. Fortunes have been made finding unfulfilled market niches and filling them.

I dont see anything like a PC charger in 45 acp or 10mm on the market. I.e. a short barreled semi auto that can take a foldable stock and be registered as a SBR for under $1000.

The buffer tubes ruins AR style PCC's for me. I like my PCC's to be as compact and lite as possible and able to shoot folded... i.e. Ruger PC Charger.